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Rnd 8: Reds v Kings

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Peter Sullivan (51)
I also think keveri has been playing well but people think he hasn't
He is the 12/13 of the future for the wallabies
I think people are starting to realise what is missing from his game, this is what is wrong with the Wallabies, we have many players that possess one good skill but lack others.

I think he has a lot of work to do on defence and off loading using two hands to the chest of whoever he is passing to instead of one handed around the corner passes. Sometimes holding the ball and retaining possession rather than forcing a pass that gets dropped is the best thing to do.
 

Ulrich

Nev Cottrell (35)
I think people are starting to realise what is missing from his game, this is what is wrong with the Wallabies, we have many players that possess one good skill but lack others.

I think he has a lot of work to do on defence and off loading using two hands to the chest of whoever he is passing to instead of one handed around the corner passes. Sometimes holding the ball and retaining possession rather than forcing a pass that gets dropped is the best thing to do.
Rohan Janse van Rensburg of the Lions, a 12, from the Lions had been criticized previously for only bashing it up (also running great lines it has to be said). This season he has improved where he holds the ball with two hands and looks for the offload.

Coaching.
 

USARugger

John Thornett (49)
I realise the game has changed over the years but many many moons ago when I played in the forwards we we taught at junior level if you dont have a clean pass then aim at the try line and run straight, at least you will get a metre.

To many times forwards believe they have to be a link man and act like a back. If nothing is happening be patient and just run straight!!!

I think our players spend too much time watching the skills of NZ forwards. We do not possess the same abilities and need to focus on being the best at what we do.

For me the backs are just as, if not more guilty of the silly offloads. Last team I played for in the states was big on offloading for continuity as we had a smallish pack but good and very fast backs. We were taught that if you can count to 2 after making contact it is too late to throw the offload 99.9% of the time. While this is obviously a "rule of thumb" I've seen it as an extremely effective one when it comes to offloading in contact.

The other rule of thumb was that if you lost the contact you generally do not want to even try to offload because it's just going to make shit much worse most of the time.

A lot of our players just seem to lack this decision-making ability in contact and then go searching for offloads that aren't there because they can't just say "no, it's not on" to themselves after a moment to look around. I think hesitation is the worst thing that a player can do on a Rugby pitch.

I'm going to pick on QC (Quade Cooper) here because she's by far the most egregious offender here and honestly should be one of our best at this skill, all things considered. I swear he's reached a 5-count and higher before throwing a dumb fucking hospital pass offload dozens of times over his Reds/Wallabies career. It's one of those fucking stupid things he does that can't seem to be coached out of him other than by Link (probably because he played his best rugby under him and he does shit like this WAY more when he's already not playing well).

The most disturbing part for me is that ANY player thinking that standing in contact that long, going nowhere, before throwing the offload is anything other than a bad idea belies a lack of game knowledge or at least a lack of application when it comes to active thinking about the game. That much time means the defensive line is reset and guess what there's no ruck so there's no offside line.. it's Rugby common sense but our boys don't seem to have much of that these days.
 

RugbyReg

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
Post match press conference here (from about 14:50):


Anyone remember an incident on Higgers (I assume) in the 2nd minute?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 

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Peter Sullivan (51)
For me the backs are just as, if not more guilty of the silly offloads. Last team I played for in the states was big on offloading for continuity as we had a smallish pack but good and very fast backs. We were taught that if you can count to 2 after making contact it is too late to throw the offload 99.9% of the time. While this is obviously a "rule of thumb" I've seen it as an extremely effective one when it comes to offloading in contact.

The other rule of thumb was that if you lost the contact you generally do not want to even try to offload because it's just going to make shit much worse most of the time.

A lot of our players just seem to lack this decision-making ability in contact and then go searching for offloads that aren't there because they can't just say "no, it's not on" to themselves after a moment to look around. I think hesitation is the worst thing that a player can do on a Rugby pitch.

I'm going to pick on QC (Quade Cooper) here because she's by far the most egregious offender here and honestly should be one of our best at this skill, all things considered. I swear he's reached a 5-count and higher before throwing a dumb fucking hospital pass offload dozens of times over his Reds/Wallabies career. It's one of those fucking stupid things he does that can't seem to be coached out of him other than by Link (probably because he played his best rugby under him and he does shit like this WAY more when he's already not playing well).

The most disturbing part for me is that ANY player thinking that standing in contact that long, going nowhere, before throwing the offload is anything other than a bad idea belies a lack of game knowledge or at least a lack of application when it comes to active thinking about the game. That much time means the defensive line is reset and guess what there's no ruck so there's no offside line.. it's Rugby common sense but our boys don't seem to have much of that these days.

basic passing skills are long gone, torpedo passes look awesome but are not the easiest to pass, I fail to see why you need to torpedo a pass to the guy 2 metres away from you.
 

Dan54

Tim Horan (67)
Maybe I'm a beaten fan. I'm just happy to see them win

Yep fair enough TOCC, and enjoy the positives, like Tuttle, who i still think is looking bloody good and that left to right cut out pass that led to a try was almost Aaron Smithiquse!!, there was some good stuff to celebrate, and then as a fan think about the other stuff later:D.
 

RugbyReg

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
Maybe I'm a beaten fan. I'm just happy to see them win


I'm with you mate. I'm thinker. Our highest score since putting 50 on the Rebels in 2011.

Also Stiles soars up the Reds coach winning percentage list passing Eddie Jones, Phil Mooney and Nick Stiles/Matt O'Connor.

Can someone remind me (I'll try to catch the replay myself some time) if, late in the game, when the Kings I think kicked through close to our line that it was Hamish Stewart who made two great tackles in a row to save tries? If it wasn't it was another reserve and i can't think who?
 

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Peter Sullivan (51)
I'm with you mate. I'm thinker. Our highest score since putting 50 on the Rebels in 2011.

Also Stiles soars up the Reds coach winning percentage list passing Eddie Jones, Phil Mooney and Nick Stiles/Matt O'Connor.

Can someone remind me (I'll try to catch the replay myself some time) if, late in the game, when the Kings I think kicked through close to our line that it was Hamish Stewart who made two great tackles in a row to save tries? If it wasn't it was another reserve and i can't think who?
I thought Pickle? Could be wrong but really great effort


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TSR

Mark Ella (57)
I'm happy to take the win, and I'm happy that we are showing a clear intent to move to a more dynamic, attacking game style.

I don't dismiss any of the criticisms of the decision making or the execution, but if we don't have an intent to attack we'll never get better at it.

I would say that I though there seemed to be as many as 4-5 offloads in the first half that were perfectly fine and well executed, but were let down by basic dropped ball.

Phil Kearns needs to watch the chiefs play more often and then maybe he'd stop crapping on about 'keeping the ball in hand'.
 
T

TOCC

Guest
Post match press conference here (from about 14:50):


Anyone remember an incident on Higgers (I assume) in the 2nd minute?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Shoulder charge on Higgers(without ball) by Kings prop, Higgers took a good hit to his ribs and took a while to get up, based on previous rulings this season it could have been a yellow card.
 

USARugger

John Thornett (49)
I should be able to grab the clip out of the replay tomorrow - not home or I'd do it tonight.

Are you guys able to access any of the content on Espn3.com or is it geo-gated? All the games are streamed live in HD and replays are available immediately after
 
T

TOCC

Guest
Tuttle is certainly looking the goods, and Mafi was solid on debut, didn't look overawed with the occasions..

There's a lot to like about Perese, plays with so much passion and great strength in contact, I don't think we've seen all of what he has to offer yet.. that been said he is young and has a few technical issues to sort out.

Ball security across the park was poor, far too many soft turnovers, forced passes and off-loads which weren't on.
 

formerflanker

Ken Catchpole (46)
Shoulder charge on Higgers(without ball) by Kings prop, Higgers took a good hit to his ribs and took a while to get up, based on previous rulings this season it could have been a yellow card.
That was my immediate impression when the incident occurred. Replays showed a late effort to bring the arm up after contact and desperate back pedaling by the commentators to justify the non-action by the ref.
 
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TOCC

Guest
Did Fa'agase come back from injury too soon, he was in a bit of pain after a scrum collapse and was subbed soon after
 

TSR

Mark Ella (57)
Stiles said he was a bit underdone fitness wise, but that the injury was fine and it was only cramping that bought him off.

I was very impressed with Mafi in the one half of footy I've seen him play. Hopefully he can go on from there.

The post game conference from Stiles was interesting. I thought (like a few here I suspect) that the off season signings gave the Reds a short term window to get success before a lot of these guys declined/retired. But Stiles obviously has a very clear intent to leverage of these guys and bring the next generation through now, come what may. There is clearly talent there, so it may prove to be a master stroke in the long run (may).

I do hope they remember to teach them to tackle though.
 
T

TOCC

Guest
Can someone remind me (I'll try to catch the replay myself some time) if, late in the game, when the Kings I think kicked through close to our line that it was Hamish Stewart who made two great tackles in a row to save tries? If it wasn't it was another reserve and i can't think who?

Yep it was Hamish Stewart, in the 78th minute, ran down the open side and then got back up and made another tackle straight away. Certain try saved..

The Initial break was made between Frisby and Stewart, and whilst Stewart turned, sprinted back and made a covering tackle, Pickle was jogging back with his hands in the air whinging that a tackle had been missed to start with...

Attitude is everything..
 
T

TOCC

Guest
Frisby and Stewart defending in the line together centre of image
IMG_5224.JPG


Stewart makes first tackle
IMG_5226.JPG


Stewart makes second tackle
IMG_5227.JPG


Stewart gets up and competes for the ball, Frisby still jogging back..
IMG_5228.JPG
 

Dan54

Tim Horan (67)
Yep it was Hamish Stewart, in the 78th minute, ran down the open side and then got back up and made another tackle straight away. Certain try saved..

The Initial break was made between Frisby and Stewart, and whilst Stewart turned, sprinted back and made a covering tackle, Pickle was jogging back with his hands in the air whinging that a tackle had been missed to start with.

Attitude is everything..

Yep I had noticed Stewart doing that in fact mate and I had both been impressed. perhaps not only Frisby could watch but Kerevi too who regardless what anyone else thinks I would be very happy to see lining up against the ABs in Bledisloe this year, seems a very limited player to me, in defence and attack.
Actually one thing I did enjoy yesterday was wearing an All Black tshirt to the game, seemed to be responsible for a bit of banter from Reds fans (and I stress good fun banter). part of an enjoyable day at rugby, even if the standard of rugby was a little disappointing.
 
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