Rugby League really gives me the shits

[ChargerWA]

Not disputing the guys pretty scummy. But is what he did worse than what Kearnsey did in his pre match video address to his Wallaby team mates before the 99 RWC final? Yet public opinion of Phil (excluding his commentary of Waratah games) would be positive.

I guess my issue is that the goal posts have moved so quickly. Our fathers generation did similar things and were loved and lauded for it in informal social circles.

We as a society need to have a serious discussion about the media and an individuals rights to privacy. My point being Carney is a fool for doing what he did in this social media age, and history has proven he is not exactly a stand up guy. But the character assassination that goes on in these instances when maybe the question should be asked why do we as the public see this thrust so vehemently into the spotlight? What's the public interest in this story from a purely journalistic point of view? To my mind there is none. The world would have kept on turning and we would all be just as happy had we been none the wiser.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I think if you are the public face of an organisation then you need to be pretty circumspect about how you behave and show some discretion. If the CEO of a listed company, a politician or head of an NGO/Charity/Church carried on like some of these footballers then they'd lose their jobs. Actually, a few of them have in the recent past (for those in WA, Troy Buswell anyone?). If you are a professional sportman or woman, you are the product and if the reputation of that product is sullied then you're in trouble.

If this was Carney's first "offence" then you'd be inclined to cut him a little slack and let it blow over. Fact is though that he's got as many of these types of incidents as he's got tats. A friend of mine who spent a fair while working in Canberra told me a couple of years ago that she'd seen him out in public a number of times and reckons he's an animal.

Still, better that all these idiots play league I suppose. I'm convinced that there are a group of professional sports people in this country across the codes who if they weren't good at sport would be robbing banks or something. Some of them aren't too bright.

 

[I like to watch]

Nah mate, the biggest difference is that Carney earns as much in a month as Kearnsy did in a year.
This is due entirely to the explosion of media,period.
In the good old days, no one heard,or saw any of the high profile players of any code outside of the window of a high profile game.

You can't put your hand out for the higher earnings due to the higher profile,then suggest it's unfair to be penalised because you have a higher profile.

 

[cyclopath]

We as a society need to have a serious discussion about the media and an individuals rights to privacy. My point being Carney is a fool for doing what he did in this social media age, and history has proven he is not exactly a stand up guy. But the character assassination that goes on in these instances when maybe the question should be asked why do we as the public see this thrust so vehemently into the spotlight? What's the public interest in this story from a purely journalistic point of view? To my mind there is none. The world would have kept on turning and we would all be just as happy had we been none the wiser.

A discussion about the role of the media certainly has some merit, but his character died at his own hand as soon as he posed to a mate with a camera pissing in his own mouth.
And like it or not, the public, in general, does seem to have a ghoulish appetite for train-wrecks like this.

 

[Braveheart81]

Not disputing the guys pretty scummy. But is what he did worse than what Kearnsey did in his pre match video address to his Wallaby team mates before the 99 RWC final? Yet public opinion of Phil (excluding his commentary of Waratah games) would be positive.

Certainly the digital age has moved things forward quickly.

The big difference with the Kearns incident is that it is all just conjecture and rumour. If a video of it happened to come out tomorrow and went viral (as it certainly would), he'd almost certainly lose his job at Foxsports within a day or two. No organisation will allow their brand and reputation to be tarnished like that.

 

[Braveheart81]

We as a society need to have a serious discussion about the media and an individuals rights to privacy. My point being Carney is a fool for doing what he did in this social media age, and history has proven he is not exactly a stand up guy. But the character assassination that goes on in these instances when maybe the question should be asked why do we as the public see this thrust so vehemently into the spotlight? What's the public interest in this story from a purely journalistic point of view? To my mind there is none. The world would have kept on turning and we would all be just as happy had we been none the wiser.

Everyone has a right to privacy, but if you want to exercise that right you need to act privately. Pissing in your own mouth (whether simulated or not) and having a photo of it taken in the bathroom of Northies clearly isn't private.

The image and discussion went viral long before any main stream media picked up the story. I think trying to argue that this wouldn't have been a big deal without the media weighing in is incorrect in this day and age. 'News' spreads very quickly regardless of whether journalists report it.

The public interest is that people are completely gobsmacked that a well known figure (even with a reputation as bad as Carney's) would do something like this. It's not like this sort of incident occurs regularly, let alone from someone who is a well known sportsperson.

 

[terry j]

so what is kearns supposed to have done?

 

[Braveheart81]

so what is kearns supposed to have done?

I can't find the original Paul Ackford article that appeared in the Telegraph (the UK one) so I'm not going to try and retell it in case it's libellous.

Let's just say that the Kearns story was mentioned at the same time as the NRL career of Joel Monaghan ended.

 

[Tex]

Re. Kearns, a simple trip down Google's infinite memory lane quickly yields results.

The moralising about the act is a bit twee and Victorian-era for my liking.

Sure, the guy has priors and is probably a liability for his employers, but pretending to piss into his own mouth is hardly worth a mention when compared to the litany of incidents from the NRL over the last decade.

 

[RugbyReg]

wasn't the Kearns thing pretty tame?

He got injured at some early stage in the tournament and went home. I think after the Ireland game? When he got home he sent a video message to the team prior to the finals that was a close up of his face, motivating them and wishing them good luck for the rest of the tournament.

He finished by saying something along the lines of "and remember - keep them nude" in relation to the fact that at that stage no one had scored a try against them (nude, as in zero tries), I guess he did it before the USA scored the one try against us in the tournament.

Anyway, after he said that, he got up and walked away from camera to show that he was nude, front pants down at least.

It was a private setting, intended for team only. Had never heard there was a dog or animal involved??? Is that the suggestion?

 

[AngrySeahorse]

You may say that the difference is that it was caught on film and made public, but I'm betting Carney wasn't responsible for either of those things.

If you walked into a pub toilet and some hobo was doing what Carney was doing, you would piss yourself laughing.

I agree this has been an overreaction but TBH if I saw anyone doing that I'd probably be more like

"Train Without A Station" has it right that without his prior issues he may have got away with this. The slate is never truly clean, rightly or wrongly.

Ignoring the Carney issue & talking more about social media specifically I don't buy the "if you want privacy do it in your own home otherwise you're fair game" argument. You can be minding your own business in a public place but still have images/film of you posted in places you'd prefer them not to be. There does not seem to be many ramifications for the people who post the images/film. Other than "oops, sorry" then taking the image/film down, but by then the damage is done anyway.

There are exceptions. Most local Rugby players I've talked to accept that photos & film are going to be taken at games from a variety of people but as long as they are used for Rugby related or private purposes then there is no issue. But we are on a slippery slope with social media I believe.

I think I was in the "sports people should be role models camp" earlier but that has changed the older I've got. It's unrealistic. I was told as a kid not to idolise sports people though, so I chose these guys instead.........

.................I regret nothing (if parents want perfection maybe they should steer their children into fantasy land).

@RugbyReg I found an article talking about it here http://storyz2tell.blogspot.com.au/2010/11/phil-kearns-and-dog.html not sure about the authenticity.

 

[BPC]

Charger, as well as the usual 'role models' stuff that people talk about, there is also the business side of the argument.
The guy is highly paid and like it or not, he is a walking, talking product of a business.
If you were the primary sponsor of the Sharks, would you be happy for your brand to be displayed across the front of Carney's jersey? I wouldn't.
When stuff like this happens, the players go or sponsors potentially walk. From a business sense, the Sharks would probably deal better with the loss of a bad egg of a player with plenty of prior form that they would with losing a sponsor.
No saying that was the case, just throwing it out there. I would've sacked him too. Wouldn't have even needed thinking music.


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Let's say a photo went around social media of a director of one of the major banks doing a Carney. How long would he last? The role model argument is tricky, but the fact he is an ambassador for his sport and employer is a lot clearer.


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[RugbyReg]

here's an honest and frank article by diehard leaguie Steve Mascord:

http://m.brisbanetimes.com.au/rugby...-your-image-stinks-fix-it-20140701-zss9q.html

 

[Braveheart81]

There is a weird mentality amongst many NRL players and fans that you should only have your employment terminated following a serious criminal conviction.

They seem to totally miss the point that the Criminal Justice System is not their employer.

Presumably it also means none of them have read their contracts. Or had someone else read them to them...

 

[I like to watch]

What sums them up,is that the clubs have no standards.
The guy who had to sack him this week, actually signed the guy twice, at two different clubs.
Both times after he had been sacked for poor behaviour.
The most recent signing was for top dollar,no discount for his previous employment history!
If there was a no dickhead policy,there would be a number of clubs scratching around for numbers.

 

[JSRF10]

I say look on the bright side, if this idiot is picked up by French rugby which is what the rumour is, it is one less young talented Aussie rugby player they can. Lets see how awesome he thinks he is when the temperature is -6 and a 21 stone Georgian is running at him.

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

I agree this has been an overreaction but TBH if I saw anyone doing that I'd probably be more like

"Train Without A Station" has it right that without his prior issues he may have got away with this. The slate is never truly clean, rightly or wrongly.

Ignoring the Carney issue & talking more about social media specifically I don't buy the "if you want privacy do it in your own home otherwise you're fair game" argument. You can be minding your own business in a public place but still have images/film of you posted in places you'd prefer them not to be. There does not seem to be many ramifications for the people who post the images/film. Other than "oops, sorry" then taking the image/film down, but by then the damage is done anyway.

There are exceptions. Most local Rugby players I've talked to accept that photos & film are going to be taken at games from a variety of people but as long as they are used for Rugby related or private purposes then there is no issue. But we are on a slippery slope with social media I believe.

I think I was in the "sports people should be role models camp" earlier but that has changed the older I've got. It's unrealistic. I was told as a kid not to idolise sports people though, so I chose these guys instead...

.......I regret nothing (if parents want perfection maybe they should steer their children into fantasy land).

@RugbyReg I found an article talking about it here http://storyz2tell.blogspot.com.au/2010/11/phil-kearns-and-dog.html not sure about the authenticity.

Many good points to discuss, AS.

I think in Carney's case it was the last straw. Like an errant teenager used to getting their own way at some point the person in charge (CEO, parent, whatever) needs to put their foot down and say enough. I think Cronulla reached that point with this individual. Far be it from me to tell the NRL how to run their code, but you'd think that they'd be issuing a general warning to the players in general about standards of behaviour. Their competition, the AFL, certainly have and union has never had behavioural issues like these guys do (not to say it couldn't happen in the future).

On the right to privacy, in your own home absolutely. But if you do something out in public you have to know that there is all sorts of surveillance now, be it people with camera phones or the government run things like CCTV on the streets. If you nude up in front of people a record is almost certainly going to be taken of it. This becomes more of a legal issue around consent I guess. However, if you are in the habit of doing things in public that may later embarrass you it might be time to reconsider how you carry on.

As far as role models go, totally agree. It's unrealistic to hold sports people up as role models and I've gone on record here at G&GR before with that view.

 

[BPC]

Maybe we are being a bit harsh. After all, he was trying to do the right thing by maintaining adequate hydration levels.

 

[AngrySeahorse]

Many good points to discuss, AS.

I think in Carney's case it was the last straw.

On the right to privacy, in your own home absolutely. But if you do something out in public you have to know that there is all sorts of surveillance now, be it people with camera phones or the government run things like CCTV on the streets. If you nude up in front of people a record is almost certainly going to be taken of it. This becomes more of a legal issue around consent I guess. However, if you are in the habit of doing things in public that may later embarrass you it might be time to reconsider how you carry on.

1st line, yes, that appears to be it.

2nd part bold. I know a scrum half who will have to cancel her annual nudie run then. I'll give her the devastating news.

 

[It is what it is]

If you can't do it, say it, or show it in front of your Mum then suggest stop.