RUPA supports a Draft System - Wayne Smith 'Australian'

[fatprop]

If RUPA is supporting it, it'd be pretty unlikely that it would ever end up in court though right? Like the AFL draft

The 2nd time around for the draft in the ARL was supported as well, until Terry Hill decided he didn't want to play for Easts

I am simply morally opposed to restrictions of trade like this, a player should have the right to ply is trade where he chooses and not be forced to play elsewhere.

Shit even salary caps are essentially employers colluding as a cartel designed to keep wages down.

 

[Mr Wobbly]

As are new players not signed to contracts, that are "forced" to sign contracts to play for teams they don't want to play for and/or move states

Let me know of an industry (say the legal industry or medical industry) where it would be legal for new employees to be put in a draft; and if not legal in those, then why in a professional sport?

So say the best legal graduate is sent to a country town as the number one draft pick

If a young fellow has an ambition to become a professional AFL player he will nominate himself for the draft in full knowledge that he could be drafted by any AFL team.

If conditions existed in the medical or legal industries where graduates were required to work for at least two years anywhere in the country then those people could make an informed choice as to whether or not it is the right career for them. Lots of kids already make the choice to relocate themselves for any number of reasons, including study and work opportunities. I believe the medical industry offers incentives for some doctors to move to under serviced areas.

Up until one weekend ago, every single player that has played for the Rebels (and most of the Force's) has relocated from somewhere for the opportunity.

I'm not saying I'm either for or against the idea of a draft in rugby but I reckon it's worth considering.

And, the argument that unproven 18 year olds would rather move to France, the UK or Japan instead of Melbourne, Canberra or Perth to try their luck as a pro footballer sounds like a stretch to me.

 

[ChargerWA]

Where are we drafting players from?

If the NBA can enforce a draft in the most litigious/personal freedom driven society in the world, I think we could manage one.

I don't think a draft is the sole answer. There should be a small draft for eligible players (18-19 year olds) who want to play Super Rugby as they finish school. It would lock in a clear pathway for them to try and realise their ambitions of being a professional rugby player. We'd probably lose less talent to the NRL too if they had a clear pathway to aim for.

But it needs to be part of a wider discussion about playing talent equalisation.

It does nothing for the game in Aus to have a team like the Force constantly at the bottom.

 

[fatprop]

If a young fellow has an ambition to become a professional AFL player he will nominate himself for the draft in full knowledge that he could be drafted by any AFL team.

If conditions existed in the medical or legal industries where graduates were required to work for at least two years anywhere in the country then those people could make an informed choice as to whether or not it is the right career for them. Lots of kids already make the choice to relocate themselves for any number of reasons, including study and work opportunities. I believe the medical industry offers incentives for some doctors to move to under serviced areas.

Incentives yes (often via uni bursaries), forced transfer, no

Up until one weekend ago, every single player that has played for the Rebels (and most of the Force's) has relocated from somewhere for the opportunity.

By the players choice, build a decent program and players will want to come

 

[TOCC]

If the NBA can enforce a draft in the most litigious/personal freedom driven society in the world, I think we could manage one.

Quite a flattering statement towards the US... I would rank many counties(Australia included) ahead of the US when it comes to civil rights and freedom indices.

NBA is completely different to Australian rugby, you have the college system which filters those players who will earn contacts, it's not a state based development system. Australian rugby has nothing similar .


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[Sully]

As are new players not signed to contracts, that are "forced" to sign contracts to play for teams they don't want to play for and/or move states

Let me know of an industry (say the legal industry or medical industry) where it would be legal for new employees to be put in a draft; and if not legal in those, then why in a professional sport?

So say the best legal graduate is sent to a country town as the number one draft pick

Teachers.

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[Train Without a Station]

Anybody talking about US Sports ignores the simple fact that they are the sole premier competition in the world.

Baseball, Basketball, Football and Hockey, if you want to play in the best competition and make the most money, it's in the MLB, NBA, NFL or NHL.

Australian rugby is different.

For one, it's 5 of 18 teams. Imagine how much of a fucking disaster it would be if the NFC had a draft but not the AFL in the NFL.

For two, it's already difficult to keep players with the competition of the NRL and European Rugby. Forcing players to go to franchises would only worsen this.

Right now if a player gets an offer from the Force but doesn't want to go to Perth he can say nah, I'm gonna stay in Sydney and slog it out in club rugby/u20s/WTS and hopefully force my way in next year.

A draft forcing them would just give them another reason to take twice the money on offer overseas.

 

[Braveheart81]

I don't see how a draft could work because the players that would be getting drafted would overwhelmingly not be offered enough money to make relocation desirable.

You surely couldn't do it at EPS level when the standard contract is around $55k pa.

A starting Super Rugby salary is somewhere around $80k.

I get the idea behind player distribution, but location is still important for players and fans and as much as possible all fans want to see their local talent playing for their team (clearly this will never be all or even the majority of players) and the rivalries would lose something if the state based histories of the teams were diluted through a draft.

It would seem like the sort of situation that would see more players heading overseas for a couple of years if they didn't end up where they desired and then coming back to join the team they want as a free agent.

A cost of living allowance like the AFL had (but with a different name) to help support the Force and the Rebels would be the best move in my opinion. Make all their Super Rugby contracts 10% larger (paid for by the ARU) to help make it more enticing for players from the traditional rugby strongholds to take up offers there.

 

[suckerforred]

If you want a way of evening out the talent perhaps you need to find out what makes players go or stay with particular franchises. It is a complicated equation that a draft is not going to solve and I agree with what many others have said before me it is just going to encourage players into the big wide world.


Like all employers, clubs/unions should be conducting exit interviews and trying to solve the problems that are preventing retention and by default recruitment before trying to 'force' players to somewhere they do not really want to be through a draft system.

 

[fatprop]

Teachers.

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Even those aren't required to move states or even towns

 

[Braveheart81]

Doctors are generally required to take regional placements. They have a convoluted system whereby you nominate the hospitals you would like to work at during various stages of your studies and after graduation and then are allocated to hospitals for various periods of time based on certain criteria. Unless you have compelling reasons like children or are married/de-facto to another doctor working in a particular city you are very likely to be allocated to various regional hospitals for extended periods of time.

Again though, they don't really have the option of going to be a doctor in the south of France for two years.

 

[Sully]

Even those aren't required to move states or even towns

Seriously never heard of country service in Qld?

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[Forcefield]

And, the argument that unproven 18 year olds would rather move to France, the UK or Japan instead of Melbourne, Canberra or Perth to try their luck as a pro footballer sounds like a stretch to me.

I don't know if anyone is making this argument. I think it would be crazy to draft out 18/19 year olds- they are too young. You'd be looking at underutilised guys in their early 20s.

But it also does happen. Jack Payne joined one of then Welsh teams (Scarlets maybe?) from the 2014 U20s. We can't afford to be losing locks at 21. Jake Ball, Welsh international lock, also left the Force at 21 (thanks for that fuck up to Richard Graham). Those are both guys who may well have stayed if the NRC was in place.

 

[Braveheart81]

Maybe a compromise system could be an NRC draft.

Super Rugby teams could be given 3 squad spots each that must go to an NRC player and last for say two years at a set value. With potentially 1-3 of these spots being in addition to the existing squad. It seems fairly apparent that squad sizes have needed to increase and are in some ways doing so by stealth with wide training squads etc.

Unsigned players in the NRC can nominate for that draft knowing that 15 players will be chosen for a spot in a squad somewhere.

If players don't want that uncertainty of potentially relocating they can choose not to nominate but then know they are competing against the open market for a Super Rugby contract otherwise.

 

[Caputo]

Another Selected quote from the article - " The issue of a draft also raises the associated problem of compensating the states that produce most of the players who do move interstate — NSW and Queensland — for the work they did in developing them. "

Payment to Shute Shield and QPR teams by another way

 

[boyo]

Teachers.

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And ambos.

 

[Forcefield]

I like the idea of an NRC draft but I'd prefer to see it distributing Super players away from the Brumbies, Rebels and Force into the NSW teams to bolster them and allow more space for WA, VIC and ACT local development. Not sure if it is what the NSW teams want though. Might be good to draft a few from Brissie city over to QLD Country too. Its entirely possible to have 9 competitive teams.

 

[liquor box]

As are new players not signed to contracts, that are "forced" to sign contracts to play for teams they don't want to play for and/or move states

Let me know of an industry (say the legal industry or medical industry) where it would be legal for new employees to be put in a draft; and if not legal in those, then why in a professional sport?

So say the best legal graduate is sent to a country town as the number one draft pick

Police officers sign a contract with their employer (state police) where there are multiple locations, if you want the job then you move to the location you are told to go to, if you do not like it you find a job somewhere else.

 

[Ozee316]

This idea was brought up by the great Jeff Wilson in New Zealand 3 years ago:

"You may not remember this but in the early years of Super Rugby [in NZ] we used to have our own draft process. With a set number of protected players, there were opportunities for young and old right across New Zealand. Coaches had the chance to fill spots, to debate, to almost trade players to achieve what Super Rugby was first all about - getting our best 125 footballers playing at a level above our NPC."

http://www.stuff.co.nz/sport/rugby/opinion/8859119/Jeff-Wilson-A-draft-could-be-a-Super-idea

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[Ozee316]

He has a very good insight on the process being one of the players to go through the first "draft" stage. It was eventually changed to the current franchise model we have today which is also successful but he asks "what about unearthing and spreading around talent?"

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