RWC QF 4 AUS v SCO (Twickenham) 19th Oct 0200 AEDT

[Groucho]

Interesting comment Groucho. I think the general consensus is that Cheika, and the rest of the support team, have done an amazing job so far and I can't recall reading any bad press or criticism of his methods. It could be said he has been playing his part to perfection and this in itself may be cause for concern. Surely, at some point in this tournament, he is going to get something horribly wrong..well, maybe that would stretching it, but it could be something as simple as a contentious call back firing. I am praying that the situation surrounding Folau, Pocock & Gits does not turn out to be the call that has serious ramifications.

Anyway, pointless to worry to much and I am really looking forward to this weekend. As much as I have enjoyed the plethora of rugby each week I am very much looking forward to the business end of the RWC.

No bad press or criticism?

jollyswagman, Cheika's earned a great deal of popular trust by beating Wales and England, and by his calls proving right, but in the early days of the tournament he was subject to ferocious criticism.

You'd have to have a special browser plugin that filters out the words "reckless", "stupid" and "incompetent" to have missed it.

You'd also have not to had gone anywhere near the Roar, or read anything by Spiro Zavos. If you're like me, you do both those things as a matter of course.

 

[Groucho]

This is what had me worried Seb. Why else would they consider bringing him back this weekend? Surely if they do end up selecting him this weekend it would suggest that a Rob Horne with a suspect shoulder is better than any other wing option available.

Surely it would suggest he's fit?

 

[Brumby Runner]

A coaching mistake was made in the game against Wales, when McMahon was replaced while Pocock was on the ground injured. It didn't come back to bite them, but it could have been decisive had Poey not been able to struggle on for a while afterwards.

 

[Lindommer]

Not a coaching mistake, BR, a timing mishap. Without checking the tournament rules I suspect McMahon was subbed the moment the change was advised to the fourth official.

 

[Groucho]

That explanation fails the basic Internet test of providing a scapegoat, Lindommer. Or whatever the equivalent term is for someone who might be to blame, but might not be, for something that could've gone wrong, but didn't. A scrapegoat?

 

[Slim 293]

You can watch the game from the comfort of the lounge, or even the heaving grandstand at Twickenham, and think you've seen it all.

You can witness Adam Ashley-Cooper race out of the line in the 69th minute and shut down Welsh five-eighth Dan Biggar before the ball is spun wide, with a try begging to be scored.

The tackle results in a penalty for the Wallabies, as they cling to the lead with two men in the sin bin, and it is immediately considered the decisive moment of the Wallabies' World Cup campaign.

You can watch all of this but what you don't see is the heroics from the veteran outside back before and after the match.

After the full-time whistle, as the crowd filters out of Twickenham, he climbs high into the stands, through the remaining fans dressed in gold, and behind the glass of a corporate suite.​

That's where he finds Guy Grinham, who he played junior rugby with and against on the Central Coast, and later knew as a referee of Shute Shield and match-day official of Super Rugby.​

Grinham is on a hospital stretcher and breathing with the assistance with oxygen tubes, but he has an unbreakable smile on his face.

"A year and a half ago he was diagnosed with cancer, and just recently he was given a brief amount of time to live," Ashley-Cooper explains from London. "Along with the help of his brother and best mate, he put together a bucket list. And on that bucket list was to watch the Wallabies at the World Cup.

"He was on his way over to watch but when he got off the plane he went downhill significantly. The cancer spread into his vertebrae, so he had to get to hospital. The nurses told him to ring his parents about coming over to give them their final goodbyes, because he didn't have much time left.

"We organised a signed jersey, and I went and saw him in hospital [before the match against Wales]. We talked about playing footy when we were younger, and what the Wallabies were doing, instead of talking about the position he was in."

Phone calls were made, favours called in, and an ambulance and nurses were arranged so Guy and his family could run a line through the big ticket item on his bucket list.

"He passed away earlier this week," says Ashley-Cooper. "He was my age - 31. He had a wife and two kids. It's a sad story. But I'm really happy I got to share a moment with him after the win. It was the least I could do, to go there and represent the group. We were on the bucket list, and that is pretty special."

As the Wallabies prepared for their quarter-final against Scotland at the same venue on Monday morning, the team gathered around and shared a moments silence in Guy's honour at a training session.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/rugby-world-cup/wallabies-adam-ashleycooper-helps-dying-friend-tick-off-bucket-list-item-at-rugby-world-cup-20151015-gk9m8o.html#ixzz3odt9dAl9

 

[The_Brown_Hornet]

What a sad story, but also what a top bloke AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is for helping with fulfilling a dying man's last wish. Massive respect from where I sit.

 

[jollyswagman]

Bloody hell.....that story sure did sneak up on me over my morning coffee. Talk about lump in the throat stuff. Beautiful story and one that really underpins the idea that this team is fully aware of who they represent when they pull on the jersey and how much "The Wallabies" mean to so many of us.

 

[jollyswagman]

No bad press or criticism?

jollyswagman, Cheika's earned a great deal of popular trust by beating Wales and England, and by his calls proving right, but in the early days of the tournament he was subject to ferocious criticism.

You'd have to have a special browser plugin that filters out the words "reckless", "stupid" and "incompetent" to have missed it.

You'd also have not to had gone anywhere near the Roar, or read anything by Spiro Zavos. If you're like me, you do both those things as a matter of course.

I am not sure if you misconstrued my tone or the point of view I was trying to express Groucho. I did use the term "general consensus" as opposed to "absolute" or "unanimous approval" as it does appear to me that the vast majority of the press that I have seen paints Cheika and his assistants in a very positive light, and rightfully so in my opinion. I wouldn't include discussions boards in my definition of press if that is where the ferocious criticism you are referring to comes from and to be honest, I do not read too much stuff on The Roar and given the choice I would rather read something written by Gregor Paul than Sprio.......as a matter of fact I think a proverbial poke in the eye with a hot stick would be preferred over either of those.

The press has proven time and again that when something goes wrong they will be looking for a scapegoat or a particular decision to which they can pin the blame. You only have to see how the UK media have reacted to England's early exit as evidence of this. The point I was attempting to make in my original post was to highlight that the consideration for selection this weekend of the four Wallabies that are currently under injury clouds has the potential be a big talking point should things backfire this weekend and one of them is forced out of the tournament. We will see discussion revolving around the question of whether or not they should have been given more time and if the risk of playing them was absolutely necessary.

 

[Groucho]

I am not sure if you misconstrued my tone or the point of view I was trying to express Groucho. I did use the term "general consensus" as opposed to "absolute" or "unanimous approval" as it does appear to me that the vast majority of the press that I have seen paints Cheika and his assistants in a very positive light, and rightfully so in my opinion. I wouldn't include discussions boards in my definition of press if that is where the ferocious criticism you are referring to comes from and to be honest, I do not read too much stuff on The Roar and given the choice I would rather read something written by Gregor Paul than Sprio...as a matter of fact I think a proverbial poke in the eye with a hot stick would be preferred over either of those.

The press has proven time and again that when something goes wrong they will be looking for a scapegoat or a particular decision to which they can pin the blame. You only have to see how the UK media have reacted to England's early exit as evidence of this. The point I was attempting to make in my original post was to highlight that the consideration for selection this weekend of the four Wallabies that are currently under injury clouds has the potential be a big talking point should things backfire this weekend and one of them is forced out of the tournament. We will see discussion revolving around the question of whether or not they should have been given more time and if the risk of playing them was absolutely necessary.

What I was responding to was this, jollyswagman:

I can't recall reading any bad press or criticism of his methods.

Not seeing any means you saw none. I was wondering how that could be the case when there was plenty. The positive consensus only emerged when we beat England. I guess if we win the thing, everyone will always have loved Cheika.

 

[jollyswagman]

What I was responding to was this, jollyswagman:



Not seeing any means you saw none. I was wondering how that could be the case when there was plenty, and much of it outright derogatory. The positive consensus only emerged after we beat England and Wales.

Not trying to be argumentative here Groucho....just curious.....but what was the angle on all the bad press Cheika was receiving at the start of the tournament, prior to beating England and Wales? Was is just left-field BS or were there valid points being raised? I was being truthful when I stated that I could not recall seeing any bad press regarding Cheika despite not having said filters installed on my browser.

 

[Groucho]

Not trying to be argumentative here Groucho..just curious...but what was the angle on all the bad press Cheika was receiving at the start of the tournament, prior to beating England and Wales? Was is just left-field BS or were there valid points being raised? I was being truthful when I stated that I could not recall seeing any bad press regarding Cheika despite not having said filters installed on my browser.

Well:

There was a long argument throughout the Supe season about Cheika's ability to function as both the Waratahs and national coach. Assertions were made about bias, and about his lack of professionalism in accepting both roles, when he clearly couldn't do both.

Then there was a long and bitter argument about the selection of Kane Douglas and Dean Mumm over (for example) Luke Jones and James Horwill. Again, accusations were made about bias. Some people said Cheika "didn't like" those players.

Then there was the long and bitter argument about the two hooker policy, which went on for weeks. Cheika was routinely described as "reckless", "stupid" and "incompetent". There are dozens (perhaps hundreds?) of posts on this forum along those lines. Similar claims were made by Spiro Zavos in his columns in the Hurled and the Roar.

Then there was bitter acrimony about Cheika's comment about not knowing about bonus points, after the Fiji game. A drive was begun on the Roar to have him removed at that point.

Are you really saying that you went online, during the months leading up to the tournament, and you didn't read a single comment along those lines? That's outstanding! Are you trolling me, or did you honestly see none of it?

If you want my opinion about whether assertions about Cheika's recklessness, stupidity and bias are justified, I obviously don't think they are. Cheika is one of the best coaches in the world.

Now that these criticisms have come to your attention, what do you think?

 

[Quick Hands]

^^You forgot about the he'd only pick Waratahs line - but then he brought Quade in and then he picked Genia ahead of Phipps. And let's not forget that many said it was reckless to pick two opensides and that Hooper and Pocock together just wouln't/couldn't work.

 

[jollyswagman]

Well:

There was a long argument throughout the Supe season about Cheika's ability to function as both the Waratahs and national coach. Assertions were made about bias, and about his lack of professionalism in accepting both roles, when he clearly couldn't do both.

Then there was a long and bitter argument about the selection of Kane Douglas and Dean Mumm over (for example) Luke Jones and James Horwill. Again, accusations were made about bias. Some people said Cheika "didn't like" those players.

Then there was the long and bitter argument about the two hooker policy, which went on for weeks. Cheika was routinely described as "reckless", "stupid" and "incompetent". There are dozens (perhaps hundreds?) of posts on this forum along those lines. Similar claims were made by Spiro Zavos in his columns in the Hurled and the Roar.

Then there was bitter acrimony about Cheika's comment about not knowing about bonus points, after the Fiji game. A drive was begun on the Roar to have him removed at that point.

Are you really saying that you went online, during the months leading up to the tournament, and you didn't read a single comment along those lines? That's outstanding! Are you trolling me, or did you honestly see none of it?

If you want my opinion about whether assertions about Cheika's recklessness, stupidity and bias are justified, I obviously don't think they are. Cheika is one of the best coaches in the world.

Now that these criticisms have come to your attention, what do you think?

Well as much as I appreciate your reply Groucho I must admit it is hard to continue this line of discussion I am having a difficult time reading your comments as anything but inflammatory.

Yes, I do recall all of those topics being discussed as you described but where there is a disconnect is with regards to the timing of those events.

Just to clarify, you stated.....

.....Cheika's earned a great deal of popular trust by beating Wales and England, and by his calls proving right, but in the early days of the tournament he was subject to ferocious criticism.

To which I replied...."just curious.but what was the angle on all the bad press Cheika was receiving at the start of the tournament, prior to beating England and Wales." None of the discussions you mentioned, with the exception of the "bonus point" concern happened in the early days of the tournament. They occurred prior to the tournament starting and it was genuine curiosity as I could not recall reading a bunch of negative press about Cheika and the coaching staff in the last 4 weeks....and I will re-iterate my belief that "discussion boards" are not the same thing as the regular press and that was not what I was referring to originally. You reference to a "drive on The Roar" to remove Cheika (from his postition?) is surprising and and absurd idea I agree that would be.......another discussion board topic I will assume as I would have a hard time believing that any self-respecting journo worth his salt would come up with that BS.

I am not trolling you though based on your critical replies to my posts I wouldn't be surprised to learn that my comments were irritating you. What bothers me the most about this discussion is that you have taken objection to a particular sentence from a longer post and drawn me into a discussion that is secondary to the idea I was trying to share....that being that the media will most likely jump all over the decision to select "players with serious niggles" if we lose any of them this weekend and it turns around to bite us on the arse. That's all.....sorry to piss you of mate

 

[John S]

http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-union/r...-richie-gray-suspensions-20151015-gkaet0.html

Saw this last night - not sure how successful they'll be.

 

[Pfitzy]

Should have appealed Ford, admitted Gray. More chance of Ford getting off if they throw the sacrificial lamb.

 

[Hemsley]

Massive Cheika fan here. Ever since the days at the Tahs when he had The golf club out to address the team. Love his style and the whole vibe about him

 

[the plastic paddy]

A tiny part of me wonders if the other unions are taking their revenge on the SRU for their 11th hour acceptance of BT/ PRL's bribe to hand over the European club game to private interest. Certainly can't complain about the Karma anyway. I hope Australia humiliate Scotland.

 

[KOB1987]

Sounds like folau and pocock will both be named in the xv

 

[aeneas]

As much as it would amuse me for the fallout on on these here forums I can't see your blokes messing this up.

Aus + 14