Springbokke vs Wallabies @ Osfontein 30/9/2017

[Brumby Runner]

So you don't factor in experience?

IMHO Rodda and Tua were selected in front of Simmons, with Simmons being the safety call

I would not actually be surprised at all to see Coleman Rodda & Tua being selected for this next test

That's a hell of a big call FP, seeing that they are the only three specialist locks now on tour as far as I am aware. Hanigan could also cover, but he is there as a 6 not a lock.

 

[Braveheart81]

That's a hell of a big call FP, seeing that they are the only three specialist locks now on tour as far as I am aware. Hanigan could also cover, but he is there as a 6 not a lock.

There are four locks on tour, Coleman, Rodda, Simmons and Tui. Arnold was the only one sent home.

 

[Brumby Runner]

There are four locks on tour, Coleman, Rodda, Simmons and Tui. Arnold was the only one sent home.

True, but Tui is apparently being schooled as a 6 if the HC is to be believed. And it is flirting with sorrow to play both Tui and Rodda together in the second row if Coleman pulls up injured before the test (as apparently is possible) and Simmons is taken off during the game.

 

[Braveheart81]

True, but Tui is apparently being schooled as a 6 if the HC is to be believed. And it is flirting with sorrow to play both Tui and Rodda together in the second row if Coleman pulls up injured before the test (as apparently is possible) and Simmons is taken off during the game.

Tui played lock on the weekend so it would seem he is not just there as a potential 6 in the longer term plan.

Either not keeping both Rodda and Tui on tour or taking Arnold as a 5th lock in case your number 1 lock gets injured during training this week seems like a pretty unnecessary thing to do when the worst outcome is the potential that you have two rookie locks on the field for some period of a test match.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

So you don't factor in experience?

IMHO Rodda and Tua were selected in front of Simmons, with Simmons being the safety call

I would not actually be surprised at all to see Coleman Rodda & Tua being selected for this next test

I do - but you couldn’t say that across the board Cheika does. There seem to be different rules applicable to some players and I’m not even sure he’s consistent in the players he seems to favour.
He sent Simmons back to NRC last year.
He played one game which I made an effort to watch. He should have been booked for loitering but instead he was back in the test squad.
I think we are close to where we were with Deans in terms of rational, understandable selections. Maybe that’s just me , but if the team start thinking like that we can forget it.

 

[Derpus]

I do - but you couldn’t say that across the board Cheika does. There seem to be different rules applicable to some players and I’m not even sure he’s consistent in the players he seems to favour.
He sent Simmons back to NRC last year.
He played one game which I made an effort to watch. He should have been booked for loitering but instead he was back in the test squad.
I think we are close to where we were with Deans in terms of rational, understandable selections. Maybe that’s just me , but if the team start thinking like that we can forget it.

It's not that bad man. There is really only rotation of a few positions. Majority have pretty strong candidates for first and second choice. So alarmist.

 

[Quick Hands]

I do - but you couldn’t say that across the board Cheika does. There seem to be different rules applicable to some players and I’m not even sure he’s consistent in the players he seems to favour.
He sent Simmons back to NRC last year.
He played one game which I made an effort to watch. He should have been booked for loitering but instead he was back in the test squad.
I think we are close to where we were with Deans in terms of rational, understandable selections. Maybe that’s just me , but if the team start thinking like that we can forget it.

He does seem to have got himself into something of a mess selection wise. This can happen when a team is tinkered with on a weekly basis (see Deans, R). Sometimes is good for a coach to wipe the slate clean and pick his best 15/23 in the most suitable positions.

 

[barbarian]

Other than lock, he has hardly tinkered at all, though. It's been the longest period of stability I can remember. Luck with injuries has really helped, too.

I think it's less a case of Cheika tinkering ad nauseam and more a case of us on here needing a selection issue/s to rant about each week.

 

[fatprop]

I do - but you couldn’t say that across the board Cheika does. There seem to be different rules applicable to some players and I’m not even sure he’s consistent in the players he seems to favour.
He sent Simmons back to NRC last year.
He played one game which I made an effort to watch. He should have been booked for loitering but instead he was back in the test squad.
I think we are close to where we were with Deans in terms of rational, understandable selections. Maybe that’s just me , but if the team start thinking like that we can forget it.

He had Mumm last year

 

[TSR]

Other than lock, he has hardly tinkered at all, though. It's been the longest period of stability I can remember. Luck with injuries has really helped, too.

I think it's less a case of Cheika tinkering ad nauseam and more a case of us on here needing a selection issue/s to rant about each week.

Well, it beats listening to my daughters crap on about who should be kicked off the
bachelor.

 

[TOCC]

I think it's less a case of Cheika tinkering ad nauseam and more a case of us on here needing a selection issue/s to rant about each week.

Wallabies have a 43% win ratio since the RWC..I don’t think it’s simply ‘issues to rant about’ given the performance of the national team over the past 18months.

 

[Derpus]

Well, it beats listening to my daughters crap on about who should be kicked off the
bachelor.

I get this shit in my office from fucking adults. Senior partners ffs.

 

[Jagman]

Wallabies have a 43% win ratio since the RWC..I don’t think it’s simply ‘issues to rant about’ given the performance of the national team over the past 18months.

That win rate is a lot better than the win rate of our Super Rugby teams against international competition over the last 18 months.

Sent from my FP2 using Tapatalk

 

[Brumby Runner]

Other than lock, he has hardly tinkered at all, though. It's been the longest period of stability I can remember. Luck with injuries has really helped, too.

I think it's less a case of Cheika tinkering ad nauseam and more a case of us on here needing a selection issue/s to rant about each week.

Not really true B. Who have been the hookers in recent times - TPN, Moore, Latu, Uelese. THP - Recently it looked like AA had the spot to himself. Now it's Kepu's. Centres have had nearly as many applicants as the locks. Beale, Kuridrani, Kerevi, Hunt, Hodge. And similarly the wingers - DHP, Speight, Nabuli, Hodge, Koroibete, Rona. There has been a lot more tinkering than I think you might be suggesting.

 

[Hawko]

Not really true B. Who have been the hookers in recent times - TPN, Moore, Latu, Uelese. THP - Recently it looked like AA had the spot to himself. Now it's Kepu's. Centres have had nearly as many applicants as the locks. Beale, Kuridrani, Kerevi, Hunt, Hodge. And similarly the wingers - DHP, Speight, Nabuli, Hodge, Koroibete, Rona. There has been a lot more tinkering than I think you might be suggesting.

I assume you would agree that the NZ side has tinkered a lot in the last two years and Hansen is therefore a stupid coach too! Look at the changes Hansen and co regularly make to bring in new players for the future, prevent burnout in his senior starters by rotating them and cope with injuries. The only difference between them and us is they have more quality players so when they bring in newbies they still get good results and don't get criticised as much for what they do.

NZ have used at least four hookers, more than two THP's, more than five centres and at least five wingers I can think of. They've used five or six locks too.

Cheika has a plan. There is substance behind what he is doing, its not just throwing a dice each week. He is building towards 2019 as well as trying to win games now. He has been saddled with some absolutely appalling Super team coaching, particularly in the fitness area, that he has also had to address.

Some things I would have done differently and if you peruse my posts you'll find plenty of examples. I do not agree with everything he does and doesn't do but give the man some credit. He's a highly credentialled coach who somehow managed to get the Waratahs a Super comp that no one else had ever managed before. McKenzie tried twice and came up just short on both occasions.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

He had Mumm last year

Stop messing with my head ;-)

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Other than lock, he has hardly tinkered at all, though. It's been the longest period of stability I can remember. Luck with injuries has really helped, too.

I think it's less a case of Cheika tinkering ad nauseam and more a case of us on here needing a selection issue/s to rant about each week.

What was Kerevi about?
Moore? (Dropped before kid news I think)
Naiyavaru
Powell
Fardy
McMahon (maybe injury meant not ready) but see Fardy
Speight/Hodge
+ what brumby runner said
There is no discernible pattern - I know you’ll come up with reasons but they’re not applied consistently.

 

[Derpus]

What was Kerevi about?
Moore? (Dropped before kid news I think)
Naiyavaru
Powell
Fardy
McMahon (maybe injury meant not ready) but see Fardy
Speight/Hodge
+ what brumby runner said
There is no discernible pattern - I know you’ll come up with reasons but they’re not applied consistently.

Just because you can't discern a pattern doesn't mean there isn't one. Likely, you can't discern a pattern because you have very limited data from which to draw your assumptions.

 

[fatprop]

Stop messing with my head ;-)

Hey, he seems to like some experienced, calm old locks around in the squad. He had two early in Douglas and Simmons, Simmons won

 

[Brumby Runner]

I assume you would agree that the NZ side has tinkered a lot in the last two years and Hansen is therefore a stupid coach too! Look at the changes Hansen and co regularly make to bring in new players for the future, prevent burnout in his senior starters by rotating them and cope with injuries. The only difference between them and us is they have more quality players so when they bring in newbies they still get good results and don't get criticised as much for what they do.

NZ have used at least four hookers, more than two THP's, more than five centres and at least five wingers I can think of. They've used five or six locks too.

Cheika has a plan. There is substance behind what he is doing, its not just throwing a dice each week. He is building towards 2019 as well as trying to win games now. He has been saddled with some absolutely appalling Super team coaching, particularly in the fitness area, that he has also had to address.

Some things I would have done differently and if you peruse my posts you'll find plenty of examples. I do not agree with everything he does and doesn't do but give the man some credit. He's a highly credentialled coach who somehow managed to get the Waratahs a Super comp that no one else had ever managed before. McKenzie tried twice and came up just short on both occasions.

Hawko, I see quite a big difference. Hanson certainly switches some of his players around, including the locks, but he does so explicitly to give his stars a rest or for injury cover. He doesn't send them back to the Mitre 10. Cheika on the other hand is usually very critical of the player he drops or the recent form of the player he drops. It is nearly always that they had a disappointing game and are being sent back to NRC to get their game together. Chalk and cheese in my eyes.