Unpopular opinion thread

[Gnostic]

Some very hard truths have come out of this whole sorry ordeal.

As predicted the ARU was very likely to be insolvent in 2019. With the cutting of the Force they have to achieve their best case business scenario to break even.

As argued for many years the insular, nepotistic, unskilled (in sports management and promotion) ARU and NSWRU/QRU are not only incompetent for the task at hand, they do not have the entirety of Australian rugby as the foremost responsibility in their minds. Remember we had the NSWRU chairman being "unashamedly selfish" with regard to the culling of the Force.

As I've said for years, RUPA is a joke, they have milked the Professional cow for all she is worth, leaving nothing and feeding her the bare minimum for survival, and continuing to demand she produce the cream. Now that some of their members have reduced employment opportunity they find their voice, very belatedly, since this has been coming for a long time.

I do not accept that often pushed "fact" that Australia doesn't have the talent depth to field 5 teams. We have plenty of players with the raw talent to fill all those sides with depth. What we do not have is coaching, in depth, from juniors and real development so skills are improved and executed under pressure. Lets not forget in the professional era we have 100+ capped Wallabies who cannot pass the ball, fullbacks amd wingers who cannot kick effectively, a 10 who continues to get charged down with ease.

Cutting a side will not make any difference to the playing abilities of our players, that requires coaching and a willingness to learn, but I am left wondering if there is a willingness to learn given they "don't give a shit about comments from outside the group".

 

[Ulrich]

Cutting a side will not make any difference to the playing abilities of our players, that requires coaching and a willingness to learn, but I am left wondering if there is a willingness to learn given they "don't give a shit about comments from outside the group".

Sounds like Cheika that.

 

[bedandbreakfast]

Couple of things. The ARU needs to be responsible for the situation they put themselves by agreeing to a ludicrous competition format. Super 12/14 worked. Play everyone once, 4 team finals. Simple. Even the Super 15 format was better but still not ideal as Aus and NZ buckled to SA request of having to play only four of each of the other two conferences (comp should have run for two extra weeks to ensure everyone played everyone at least once).

The decision to expand the competition to include Japan and Argentina was only announced a month after Clyne became the chair of the board (he was a member for 2 years prior) and due to our financial state one we pretty much had to take. There was a clear decline in performance and viewership in Australia prior to this however it absolutely fell of a cliff after. Once this was realised and the additional broadcast money was eaten up things had to change.

However the Force too need to take responsibility for their poor financial management. This point has been missing in the discussion for sometime. Anytime a finger gets pointed at the Force it turns into a mudslinging match "well the Rebels got more" or the "tahs/Reds were bailed too" but that doesn't change what has happened to them or the situation we are now in.

The Force have been around for 12 years and Twiggy has only been a sponsor of Hodgo's jersey through FMG for $50k over a couple of seasons. Why has it taken until now for him to get behind them? Its a fair point. I have some hesitation in putting blind trust into a billion dollar business man when at this stage the only thing Twiggy has done is run a hate campaign against the ARU gaining free publicity by feeding off the Wests distrust of the East. Throwing around $50m commitment comments where we have no idea of the caveats attached.
I am a rugby person and I want to the game to grow outside the traditional areas. The Force have done a great job in their short life and needed longer to develop. Both sides have to take blame for the current situation. The situation isn't nearly as easy as its being portrayed nor as one sided. I honestly believe Clyne in that if Twiggy had of been apart of the discussions 18mths ago things would be a lot different.

Parse on another note, good comment. I am glad there is still places for decent rugby chat. People who have different opinions can voice them without being personally bagged.

Andrew Forrest has been a supporter and sponsor of the Force from the start and has also put in a lot of funding into the Future Force program. He is also involved in Perth community rugby.

 

[Brumby Runner]

I'm sure we would be fine if we had of got the extra 12m the Rebs got and the extra 2m+ pa for ARU top ups that the Tahs got every year.
Over just the last 5 years that would be 22m.
Good luck getting anything from the ARU after 2020, maybe get rid of the Rebs and the Brumbies so you and the Reds can share the spoils.

If I had any confidence at all in the ARU's long term planning abilities, I'd suggest that is probably the outcome they are working towards.

 

[TOCC]

Hindsight is a wonderful thing.

If only we could all see into the future, we could all make perfect decisions.

You mean there's an expectation that organisations conduct due diligence and research on the deals they are committing themselves too???!

 

[Tex]

Uncomfortable opinion: I'm glad the Rebels survived a shit house year and look forward to seeing who our new recruits are for 2018.

(sorry)

 

[joeyjohnz]

If Super Rugby continues post 2020 and includes South Africa, the Rebels won't be a part of it.

 

[louie]

Andrew Forrest has been a supporter and sponsor of the Force from the start and has also put in a lot of funding into the Future Force program. He is also involved in Perth community rugby.

As Matt Giteau asked were was Mr Forrest during the firepower chaos? That debacle did everlasting damage to Oz rugby.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

I don't get the angst about why TF did not get involved years ago blah blah....as anytime a billionaire suddenly wants to get involved and financially support rugby in this country I would have thought with the code in such dire financial straits that would just be grateful for them being involved now, not why they have not got involved sooner.

 

[louie]

I don't get the angst about why TF did not get involved years ago blah blah..as anytime a billionaire suddenly wants to get involved and financially support rugby in this country I would have thought with the code in such dire financial straits that would just be grateful for them being involved now, not why they have not got involved sooner.

Because he would have known about the Forces financial problems all along yet at the very last minute (when he knows it's useless) he steps into the light offering his white knight services. And what has done? instead of actually helping he's proposing a BS comp that will never get of the ground and getting his name in the headlines.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Because he would have known about the Forces financial problems all along yet at the very last minute (when he knows it's useless) he steps into the light offering his white knight services. And what has done? instead of actually helping he's proposing a BS comp that will never get of the ground and getting his name in the headlines.

Fair enough for your view. Early days for this new comp and prepared to wait and see if gets off the ground.


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[Killer]

Because he would have known about the Forces financial problems all along yet at the very last minute (when he knows it's useless) he steps into the light offering his white knight services. And what has done? instead of actually helping he's proposing a BS comp that will never get of the ground and getting his name in the headlines.

Twiggy could never have been early enough unless he came in years ago.
The problem was that Clarke and Clyne wanted the Rebels saved because of their connections down there.
No surprise that Clarke is back in the Rebels fold now.
So when, because of their allegiance to the Rebs, they didn't buy Cox's licence when it was available they locked themselves into only one option and that was the Force.

 

[louie]

Twiggy could never have been early enough unless he came in years ago.
The problem was that Clarke and Clyne wanted the Rebels saved because of their connections down there.
No surprise that Clarke is back in the Rebels fold now.
So when, because of their allegiance to the Rebs, they didn't buy Cox's licence when it was available they locked themselves into only one option and that was the Force.

They didn't buy the license because they can't afford it.

 

[TOCC]

Because he would have known about the Forces financial problems all along yet at the very last minute (when he knows it's useless) he steps into the light offering his white knight services. And what has done? instead of actually helping he's proposing a BS comp that will never get of the ground and getting his name in the headlines.

That's bullshit claiming that he only came to the party once he knew he was useless, the bloke clearly has an intention to help the Force! What does he possibly have to gain by committing himself to a battle he know he won't win? And how else is he supposed to support the Force is not provide a soft landing for the team to play in?

 

[louie]

That's bullshit claiming that he only came to the party once he knew he was useless, the bloke clearly has an intention to help the Force! What does he possibly have to gain by committing himself to a battle he know he won't win? And how else is he supposed to support the Force is not provide a soft landing for the team to play in?

Then why did he leave last possible moment to help? He'd have known about there problems a long time ago and could have done something.

If he wants to help he can pump money into the Spirit. The NRC is WA and Australia hope now.

 

[TOCC]

Then why did he leave last possible moment to help? He'd have known about there problems a long time ago and could have done something.

If he wants to help he can pump money into the Spirit. The NRC is WA and Australia hope now.

He has made no secret that the decided to get involved once it emerged the ARU's process for determining which team to get cut was unfairly targeting the Force.

NRC is hardly the solution, it's a good development tool for players but it's not a good vehicle for connecting with the rugby public and spreading the game, that much is clear. To invest in the Spirit, whilst all the other teams maintained the same level of funding would be a waste of money.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Then why did he leave last possible moment to help? He'd have known about there problems a long time ago and could have done something.



If he wants to help he can pump money into the Spirit. The NRC is WA and Australia hope now.

Come on - he instigated the Adelaide meeting with a generous offer in return for revoking the decision to cut the Force. Mate you are going overboard with the criticism of TF's involvement as what you don't get is he actually at any point did not have to get involved but did. So what the better late than never does not apply? You are suggesting his support for the Force is not genuine and I find that hard to believe with the going's on.

 

[louie]

He has made no secret that the decided to get involved once it emerged the ARU's process for determining which team to get cut was unfairly targeting the Force.

NRC is hardly the solution, it's a good development tool for players but it's not a good vehicle for connecting with the rugby public and spreading the game, that much is clear. To invest in the Spirit, whilst all the other teams maintained the same level of funding would be a waste of money.

Judging by crowd numbers, ratings and results neither is super rugby. Only it cost more $$$ and we don't own it...

 

[TOCC]

Judging by crowd numbers, ratings and results neither is super rugby. Only it cost more $$$ and we don't own it.

No increasingly its not, but it's still on another level to the NRC.. they aren't like for like by any means

 

[louie]

No increasingly its not, but it's still on another level to the NRC.. they aren't like for like by any means

not now but it could be. It's getting better every year. Australia rugby fans want a national comp. With proper funding it could really work.