Wallabies vs England, Sydney, 3rd Test, 25 June @ 8:00pm

[Joe Blow]

Cheika has said that all of his OS Giteau law qualified players have said they are in for the RC and I am guessing that Douglas and Pocock will be fit as well. Barring further injury(of which we may have a few) Beale will be the only big name missing.
He then has Giteau and To'omua to back up Foley and to play at 12. Lealifano and QC (Quade Cooper) will be available as well.
Simmons looked good in his time on the pitch on the weekend. The little kick in the backside obviously did the trick. He and Douglas form our best starting second row for now with Arnold, Coleman and Carter lapping at their heels. I imagine that both Coleman and Arnold have a lot of improvement in them and hopefully they both put their hand up to start very soon.
Giteau and Mitchell give us some excellent left foot kicking options which will help our game immeasurably and teamed up with an improved Foley(we hope) and DHP gives us a decent all around kicking game. Gits kicking for field position is particularly polished and having Mitchell and DHP clearing the lines on either side will put us in a much better place than we have been in this series.
There are 7 odd weeks until the Bled but I imagine a backline like this will work well.

9.Genia
10.Foley
11.Tomane
12.Giteau
13.Folau
14.Mitchell/AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)
15.DHP

At the same time we need to be looking ahead by blooding Hodge and Holloway and also a TH prop I would think. Kepu was not at his best in this series and we need to plan for 2017 when Pocock will be on Sabbatical.

 

[USARugger]

If Tomane can get back fit and firing, that alone will change the dynamic of the entire backline.

Put Tomane on the end of the line receiving those balls into space instead of Fardy and you're going to get tries out of him if he's playing anywhere near where he was before the injury.

 

[TOCC]

England were good this series, but were they very good great? Absolutely not..
I watched the last game with the All Blacks in the back of my mind, so I'm not content with finishing within 7 of England, a similar performance against the All Blacks with such basic mistakes and also giving the All Blacks possession so easy will result in an absolute flogging..

Yeah I don't have an answer to who should replace Foley, but he needs to improve his kicking game, if Foley can't improve his kicking then maybe the Wallabies need to look to someone else.

He isn't the reason the Wallabies lost, there were collective reasons for the loss, but a better kicking performance could have been the reason the Wallabies won.

 

[bigmac]

England were good this series, but were they very good great? Absolutely not..
I watched the last game with the All Blacks in the back of my mind, so I'm not content with finishing within 7 of England, a similar performance against the All Blacks with such basic mistakes and also giving the All Blacks possession so easy will result in an absolute flogging..

Yeah I don't have an answer to who should replace Foley, but he needs to improve his kicking game, if Foley can't improve his kicking then maybe the Wallabies need to look to someone else.

He isn't the reason the Wallabies lost, there were collective reasons for the loss, but a better kicking performance could have been the reason the Wallabies won.

Foleys terrible kicks put us under pressure which led to tries. I'm a tahs supporter but foley needs to be replaced asap.

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[Chronicle]

So immediately after the test which we lose the coach signals that the best performed Australian back will have his position taken by a player not even playing in this country.
Did anyone see Giteau's performance in the Top14 final because I did and I am not seeing any answers to Australia problems.
IMO a lot of the comments about Eddie Jones coaching in the last couple of pages could relate to Cheika
Is it any wonder To'omua and others are seeking to go overseas if that is the loyalty shown to them, he returns from injury plays his guts out has a blinder gets replaced and his position is given away to another by the coach in a post match press conference hell of a way to build team spirit

 

[cyclopath]

So immediately after the test which we lose the coach signals that the best performed Australian back will have his position taken by a player not even playing in this country.
Did anyone see Giteau's performance in the Top14 final because I did and I am not seeing any answers to Australia problems.
IMO a lot of the comments about Eddie Jones coaching in the last couple of pages could relate to Cheika
Is it any wonder To'omua and others are seeking to go overseas if that is the loyalty shown to them, he returns from injury plays his guts out has a blinder gets replaced and his position is given away to another by the coach in a post match press conference hell of a way to build team spirit

I don't think the team for 7 weeks time has been picked yet, and Cheika praised To'omua's game and how 2 playmakers worked better, and talked up Leali'ífano after the game. Might be worth putting the outrage on hold if you can. I'm happy to see depth and options available for TRC, especially since we don't know what might happen injury-wise between now and then. More old and wise heads around the squad can only help.

 

[KOB1987]

So immediately after the test which we lose the coach signals that the best performed Australian back will have his position taken by a player not even playing in this country.
Did anyone see Giteau's performance in the Top14 final because I did and I am not seeing any answers to Australia problems.
IMO a lot of the comments about Eddie Jones coaching in the last couple of pages could relate to Cheika
Is it any wonder To'omua and others are seeking to go overseas if that is the loyalty shown to them, he returns from injury plays his guts out has a blinder gets replaced and his position is given away to another by the coach in a post match press conference hell of a way to build team spirit

All he said was that he saw them all in January and they have all said they will be available for selection. They will need to earn their spots in the side just like every other player. Competition is healthy.

 

[Viking]

Gits has the advantage of a left boot which greatly takes pressure off Foley from kicking, plus he is probably a better goal-kicker then Foley too. Those 2 areas are key problems - unfortunately for To'omua that gives Gits a huge advantage come selection time. - Which is annoying as hell given it's directly related to Foley's weaknesses but To'omua is one who's punished. That's rugby though.

 

[Strewthcobber]

When does To'omua's contract with Leicester start? Is he going to play all of TRC?

 

[Joe Blow]

I think it was a shame that To'omua was not given more time in the 12 jersey through the RWC. He and Foley went well together as did Quade and To'omua.
It's great to bring back our aging stars from OS but it's unlikely they will play a part in 2019. To'omua could and I hope that Cheika is working on him to make his OS jaunt shorter rather than longer.

 

[Braveheart81]

To'omua had an excellent game and his return was important for the Wallabies.

The suggestion that we shouldn't bring back experienced overseas players that could potentially push someone else good out of the starting XV is ridiculous though.

Is there any suggestion that To'omua is heading overseas because he can't get a game for the Wallabies? His reasons seem completely unrelated. He has been selected in the matchday 23 of the vast majority of test matches he has been available for since he debuted.

 

[Joe Blow]

I am not suggesting that we do not bring back those players for this RC but we do need to also be thinking about bringing through the young players that will be around through until 2019 and beyond.

 

[Braveheart81]

I am not suggesting that we do not bring back those players for this RC but we do need to also be thinking about bringing through the young players that will be around through until 2019 and beyond.

It can't hurt to have those experienced players as part of the squad though.

We debuted five players during this series and had a bunch more inexperienced players play tests.

I think plenty of new players in the squad is important but I don't think selecting them for big test matches is much of a benefit unless they are really ready.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I would have thought you need your old heads to impart their knowledge to the new blokes, otherwise you're reinventing the wheel every 4 years

 

[MarkJ]

Gits has the advantage of a left boot which greatly takes pressure off Foley from kicking, plus he is probably a better goal-kicker then Foley too. Those 2 areas are key problems - unfortunately for To'omua that gives Gits a huge advantage come selection time. - Which is annoying as hell given it's directly related to Foley's weaknesses but To'omua is one who's punished. That's rugby though.

Or you could play Gits at 10 and To'omua at 12 (not necessarily advocating this but it could be an option).

 

[Gnostic]

Just re kicking mentors, specialist kicking coaching etc:



http://www.espn.com.au/rugby/story/_/id/16514574/owen-farrell-pays-tribute-jonny-wilkinson-kicking-england-series-whitewash

That is telling. The skill deficit in the Australian players has nothing to do with desire or innate skills and everything about proper critique and coaching. Is there anybody on this forum who'd honestly say that Farrell is a better 10 than Foley? If they truly think that they have a very poor understanding of the game. Farrell is a good player and undisputedly the best goal kicker in the world. But the hysteria around the series loss is focussed totally on selections with a little real thought about what caused the major differences in the sides.

I see so much from people attacking their usual favourite targets for vitriol. Skelton, Palu, Phipps, Foley and Horne.

Should it be surprising that all those named who seem to get nearly of the hate mail are Tahs? No, not really when I look at the authors.

With regard to Phipps, Foley and Horne as Cyclo has said, who were the options and honestly what in balance were the skill/execution improvements they could bring. With regard to Palu after McCalman's injury (and I do not forget that McCalman also generated a fair amount of negative comment) who else was there to select at 8 as a reserve (I did suggest Gill myself).

Now Skelton. Finally ask yourselves why in three tests we had 3 different locking combinations? Selection instability is a give away that some selection KPI wasn't being met. I'd like to know what it is, because honestly I do not see the performances of the second row in any of the three tests as a significant issue when I consider the kicking from hand and tee. It is so easy to attack Skelton, he is huge he should be having bigger impact blah blah blah.

If Foley had made touch with his first penalty for touch they would have been deep on attack instead of being driven back into their own half. Execution of the kicking skill was deficient, just as in test 2 in exactly the same circumstances. If the Wallabies over three tests had converted their actual attempts at goal at the long term average of Foley 80-86% the Wallabies would have won tests one and two. This is before any of the other debate even occurs.

Do not take me wrong I do not blame Foley, I blame the lack of effective coaching in kicking. He has the ability and has demonstrated that.

 

[Viking]

Or you could play Gits at 10 and To'omua at 12 (not necessarily advocating this but it could be an option).

I'd rather Foley at 10 even with the poor kicking. He is our best available 10 by some margin, I think we all need to accept that.

 

[Gnostic]

And perhaps one of the biggest dud ideas, Skelton to 8.

1. In as many posts Skelton is dumped on for being fat and lazy and unfit.
2. Then the suggestion is move him to 8 because the above assertion wouldn't be as noticeable at 8?
3. Those players who have filled in at 8 for the Wallabies have been specialists, extremely skilled (Pocock) or have significant experience at 8 (McMahon). If you want to have a look at what happens when you put somebody at 8 who has no real idea about the position, havea watch of the Australian U20s defeat to NZ. A dominant scrum ended up with compromises possession at least 6 times, 4 of them 5 metres or less from the line because the 8 couldn't control the ball in the scrum That is just one of the aspects of 8 play that would be effected badly with this idiotic suggestion.

 

[Scrubber2050]

Moore's performance overall was pretty average.

His performance with those 2 linelouts cost is bigtime on the scoreboard.

His performance as Captain left a lot to be desired.

 

[green and gold kiwi]

To'omua must be in the mix somewhere , what a great little player he is.
I'd like to see big taqele have more opportunity.
gits, a must, folau a must