2.You're in agreement with"A model" ? Presumably any model.
Why not attempt to obtain the best model possible,& try to make THAT model work,logically with the best outcome?
Because this IS the best model available within the constraints (time and effort), as evidenced by the fact it is off the ground and flying.
Have you ever worked in project management? Sit around a table with 5 different people and ask them all how something should be done - you won't get the same answer 5 times.
You have a deadline, you work towards it, and you try your best to satisfy the goal. That's all you can do. Once you establish the outcome, you run through the next iteration to improve it, after learning the lessons.
As they say: experience is something you get only after you need it.
3.In your post above #394, you complain about the frustration you have experienced with your involvement in Rugby in western Sydney,about being the poor relation relative to other regions,
& poor treatment of the West by governing bodies, yet you are quite happy to accept the continuance of this situation as evidenced in the current RAMS team,with the strange belief that
it will all be O.K. sometime in the future.
Logically why will it be better if the Wests supporters passively accept more of the same?
Lay back & think of mother England comes to mind.
I'm quite happy to accept the status quo because I believe it can be built on. Premier Rugby is fucked - utterly, Utterly, FUCKED. Being dictated to by a bunch of wankers boils my piss no end. I get enough of that at work! But Shute Shield and Brisbane Premier Rugby have not grown their ability to deliver ready talent like the ITM Cup and Currie Cup have - that's why we're even talking about the NRC.
I'm playing the long game. You don't win a war in the first battle; you win it with victory in the last. I'm realistic enough to realise that winners are grinners, and if we don't get this going with whatever cards are dealt, we're destined to drive it into the ground and repeat the mistakes of the past.
Are you saying you would rather see Greater Sydney NOT have a team in the comp because you don't think its all it can be? Because it has flaws? Because the players aren't all exclusively from west of the M3?
What you're saying, in effect, is that you're perfectly happy to cut off your nose to spite your face.
4.Why do you believe that success of the RAMS ,& success of Rugby in the Western Sydney clubs is somehow mutually exclusive?
Why can't success of both entities occur at the same time.Surely success of Rugby in the West would enhance the likelihood of success with the RAMS team & so on up the ladder.
The two factors aren't mutually exclusive. I never said they were.
If the Rams aren't successful, most of the clubs associated with the venture will continue to languish in the bottom half of the table - in fact that would be the case in perpetuity if the NRC doesn't go ahead.
But what is your plan for making the clubs successful in order to support the Rams? Because it hasn't worked for the last 20 years and I don't think the other variables are about to change.
Penrith propping up the table isn't going away any time soon for the reasons we've already discussed i.e. talented players at poor clubs get hoovered up by rich clubs. Parramatta will threaten occasionally, but flicker. The Pirates and Rebels are mid-table finishers with the occasional great performance like 2013, but ultimately no-one is going to win the competition in front of Sydney Uni with things the way they are.
Rugby needs to grow its presence in Sydney outside of the eastern suburbs - I think we can all agree on that. The Rams can give rugby a point of presence to focus the supporter base in order to help generate more support for
rugby. Not just the Rams:
RUGBY.
The success of the Rams allows us to start tapping into the talent that Western Sydney grows both within and outside of rugby. Once it is decided as a clear pathway to representation, and not a poor cousin to rugby league or the eastern suburbs and north shore Shute Shield clubs, then momentum can start to build.
But you can't necessarily maintain it with a 9-week competition. I'm thinking beyond this year, and unfortunately - realising I will cop a LOT of shit for this - I can't see Premier Rugby in its current form surviving an expansion of the NRC in future.
This is the natural consequence of the 3rd tier being so important for rugby nationally. It will become a feeder system and clubs will decide how they go up against that. Overall, with clubs like Uni putting their focus into the more prestigious competition, it will help equalise the Premier Rugby situation for the 4th tier.
When this happens, the NRC season runs in parallel with Premier Rugby, and the competition expands. Eventually we have the Greater Sydney Rams gravitate into Western Sydney proper, and other ventures can start up. This isn't the final destination - its a journey.
5.Yes players ,when they move to another club,usually do move to what they perceive is a more successful club.
Unfortunately most player movements in recent years,are mostly in one direction, i.e. away from the clubs in the West & I cannot see any reason now, why this will change,& what
may be more likely,i.e. even more players will join the exodus.
Taking this point with the one above:
Please point out the positives in the club rugby system as it exists right now, in terms of adequately promoting Greater Sydney talent within its own clubs and not as recruitment centres for richer clubs.
Frame this answer in the current position of Penrith and Parramatta on the ladder, and their recent history at facing the rest of the competition. Ensure at all times you keep in mind what I assume is your selection policy; that equal representation is guaranteed (and therefore discriminatory against the working conditions i.e. being the best player).
I would imagine that you consider it a condition of Eastwood's participation that they have a MAXIMUM of 4 players in the match day XXIII, given they're providing no financial backing, despite their team currently running 2nd in Shute Shield. Please confirm that point in your discussion.
Then let me know how you're going to be competitive against the following conglomerates:
- Sydney Uni and Balmain (the two richest clubs in Sydney, with the best facilities)
- Easts, Randwick, and "Country"
- Manly, Warringah, Norths, and Gordon
- sole city teams like Melbourne, Perth, and UC Vikings, with their squads heavily laden with Super Rugby players.
You tell me which players are going to deliver that equity using this magical understanding under which you and the other naysayers are operating.
I'll be fascinated to hear it.
