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Rebels 2013

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swingpass

Peter Sullivan (51)
"Of the 60 or so players picked up by the Rebels in some professional capacity there has been 1 Victorian appear in a trial game (not officially contracted in any capacity) and 1 in full games (previously capped by Queensland). Basically, we have backed no fresh local talent at Super Rugby level and we started building this team 4 years ago and it's our 3rd playing season."

enforcer i think you argue your case well.

perhaps the rebels organisation hasn't pushed the young locals hard enough, but its also possible in their opinion none have so far been good enough. yet!
 

en_force_er

Geoff Shaw (53)
"Of the 60 or so players picked up by the Rebels in some professional capacity there has been 1 Victorian appear in a trial game (not officially contracted in any capacity) and 1 in full games (previously capped by Queensland). Basically, we have backed no fresh local talent at Super Rugby level and we started building this team 4 years ago and it's our 3rd playing season."

enforcer i think you argue your case well.

perhaps the rebels organisation hasn't pushed the young locals hard enough, but its also possible in their opinion none have so far been good enough. yet!

I would say that would be the case and I understand why it would be. But look, why not do something bold with 2 of your EPS spots?

I struggle to think somebody like Samu who's trialed well in the 45-squad for the Tahs in the preseason isn't good enough for the Rebels EPS, plus he's a Victorian.

Fainga'a? Can't find anything on this.

Which one anyway?

It's in the Brumbies thread and that's basically all that is written.

I presume because it's the Brumbies thread it's Colby. It's obviously very much hearsay.
 

Dumbledore

Dick Tooth (41)
I understand sport is a business but there's a line between "petty provincialism" and what we're doing now.

If you noticed I listed no established players, nobody was begging for Taps to come home but I was saying let's look at young blokes who could enter our program. I listed 3 number 8s as an example of blokes who would be genuine possibilities in a particular position.

Plus, it's a bit strange to bring up the lack of provincialism point then list a bunch of young guns who by the same logic will move on in a couple of short seasons to greener business opportunities.
They might move on to greener pastures or, if they buy into what the Rebels are doing, they'll stay. Look at a team like Geelong in the AFL where they've managed, for years, to hang onto a host of stars by convincing them to keep playing at below market value for the chance to play finals footy.

Getting Melbourne boys is a good look for the club scene - if they've come through the Melbourne club scene. Picking up people who once played in Melbourne from the Shute Shield or France doesn't really help the Melbourne scene as all it says is you have to move elsewhere to succeed. People like to see young players get developed by their club, but, in my experience, they generally don't care how they arrived. For example I really couldn't care less that Hugh Pyle came through the Canberra grade system, or whatever it was. I care about the player, not the club. Now he's at the Rebels, I consider him a Rebels player and I'd be disappointed if he left because he was developed as a Soup player here.

My personal thoughts are that if the Rebels want to start getting 25-30k crowds to home games week-in, week-out, they're going to have to start winning. Picking Melbourne-based players isn't going to help that at the moment. Picking up the most talented 18-19-20 year olds in the country and bringing them along from year one, allowing spectators to get involved in that journey, will. If a Melbourne boy is the most talented in his position, then by all means take him, but I don't think they should be given special preference.
 

KevinO

Geoff Shaw (53)
On another note some Rebels in action this week

VRU
Southern districts - Shota Horie
Quins - Reid and Rokobaro
Powerhouse - Hegarty
Melb Uni - Tom English

Shute Shield
Syd Uni - Tim Davidson
Manly - Eddie Aholelei and Pat Leafa
 

FiveStarStu

Bill McLean (32)
My personal thoughts are that if the Rebels want to start getting 25-30k crowds to home games week-in, week-out, they're going to have to start winning. Picking Melbourne-based players isn't going to help that at the moment. Picking up the most talented 18-19-20 year olds in the country and bringing them along from year one, allowing spectators to get involved in that journey, will. If a Melbourne boy is the most talented in his position, then by all means take him, but I don't think they should be given special preference.

They need to do both. People will tolerate a losing team whose mission they're bought into. If the Rebels were a true Victorian team, rather than just a team in Victoria, they could survive the troughs better.

But yes, to get Joe and Joanne Average to care about the team, they need to be consistently good. The advantage teams like the Waratahs have is that when they suck, the state arks up and they have fan forums and the like.

That won't happen here. If the Rebels continue to suck, people just won't care.
 

FiveStarStu

Bill McLean (32)
You'd be familiar with the buzz around a club when a Rebels player is playing for your 1s? Imagine if the bloke who played your kid all through juniors suited up for the Rebels? Same thing but even better. It's about COMMUNITY ENGAGEMENT.

This is why it absolutely does matter that we start to see Dewar Shield players in the Rebels. When Kemu Valetini from Quins made his debut in the Hobart trial, people from the club flew down to see it.

The Victorian rugby community is so tight-knit, the effect of a junior Quin seeing someone they know, like Kemu, as a Rebel would be immeasurable.

That's how the Rebels make themselves matter.
 

Dumbledore

Dick Tooth (41)
They need to do both. People will tolerate a losing team whose mission they're bought into. If the Rebels were a true Victorian team, rather than just a team in Victoria, they could survive the troughs better.

But yes, to get Joe and Joanne Average to care about the team, they need to be consistently good. The advantage teams like the Waratahs have is that when they suck, the state arks up and they have fan forums and the like.

That won't happen here. If the Rebels continue to suck, people just won't care.
Don't quite buy that. People will buy into a team for a whole lot of reasons, I don't think traditional reasons like geographic location and class matter as much any more. What the Rebels need is a narrative, something people can buy into. Look at, say, the Wanderers in the A-League. That's an amazing story that people will get involved with because they want to be part of the movement. At the moment the Rebels aren't selling a story as a team, they're just floundering along at the bottom of the table. The Victorian rugby community is tight-knit, but it's also small. I feel like the VRU and Rebels need to invest heavily in the grassroots, so that in 10 years time we start seeing young guys coming through the system. For now though, I don't see any material advantage in pulling in Melbourne-born players from overseas or interestate just because it might make the small rugby-playing community happy. I reckon for the average supporter at a Rebels game, rugby will be their second sport behind AFL. They need a compelling reason to go to the rugby week-in, week-out, and having two Victorian players in the team won't do that.
 

Sir Arthur Higgins

Dick Tooth (41)
i don't care if there is melbournians in the team or not.
i am concerned about good players. do the people who support rugby and have friends in the local comp not go to rebels games because their friends aren't playing? i'd be surprised.
not having many sydney born players doesn't seem to affect the swans.
 

swingpass

Peter Sullivan (51)
five star stu i can see your point but i agree with the winning aspect. dumbledore is right, a successful team will bring in the crowds both traditional hard core rugby fans and newbies. if it contains victorians that will be a bonus but personally i don't care that mitch inman is from sydney or that jason woodward is from wellington, in melbourne they are rebels, and i want them to be successful to encourage a new generation to aspire to stay and play in their home state, but that is a longterm view
 

Rock Lobster

Larry Dwyer (12)
I would say that would be the case and I understand why it would be. But look, why not do something bold with 2 of your EPS spots?

I struggle to think somebody like Samu who's trialed well in the 45-squad for the Tahs in the preseason isn't good enough for the Rebels EPS, plus he's a Victorian.



It's in the Brumbies thread and that's basically all that is written.

I presume because it's the Brumbies thread it's Colby. It's obviously very much hearsay.
It is Colby & you can take it as gospel
 

Athilnaur

Arch Winning (36)
Our player roster has to be the best mix of players it can be. It doesn't matter if they aren't from Victoria, or even Australia. We must win. Nothing else matters in a state where aerial ping pong rules. Win and we can offer improved development paths because the young guys will come here first. Win and we will get the best marquee players. Win and we will get crowds.

Melbourne loves great sport and it loves winners.
 

Bowside

Peter Johnson (47)
I feel a bit sad that you lads don't have the provincialism as part of your rugby culture. Say you don't need it all you want, but it makes the victories that much sweeter. Especially when you know a few of the blokes playing because you came up playing with or against them.
 

elementfreak

Trevor Allan (34)
On another note some Rebels in action this week

VRU
Southern districts - Shota Horie
Quins - Reid and Rokobaro
Powerhouse - Hegarty
Melb Uni - Tom English

Shute Shield
Syd Uni - Tim Davidson
Manly - Eddie Aholelei and Pat Leafa
Interesting that Melbourne and Moorabbin haven't used their Rebels.

Also
Following the great success of Conversion For Clubs, RaboDirect would like to reward Victorian Rugby affiliated Schools for showing their support for the RaboDirect Rebels.

This initiative rewards Schools that provide the most 2013 NEW five, three and one game RaboDirect Rebels members.

By supporting your RaboDirect Rebels, it is a chance to 'own' the Rebels' inaugural Tour Match at AAMI Park when we take on the powerhouse, The British & Irish Lions on June 25th 2013.

Click here to see exactly how it works and how your School can receive cash and Gilbert Rugby Pack from RaboDirect!

Trying for Schools Sevens will kick off at 8:30am at Xavier College with your RaboDirect Rebels taking part in the carnival.

Paul Alo-Emile - Melbourne High School
Scott Fuglistaller - Marcellin College
Nic Henderson - Melbourne Grammar
Scott Higginbotham - Trinity Grammar
Mitch Inman - St Francis Xavier
Luke Jones - St Kevin's College
Lachlan Mitchell - Ivanhoe Grammar
Cadeyrn Neville - Xavier College
James O'Connor - Scotch College
Nick Phipps - Brighton Grammar
Hugh Pyle - Melbourne Grammar
Angus Roberts - Ivanhoe Grammar
Ged Robinson - Haileybury College
Rory Sidey - Melbourne High School
Nic Stirzaker - Carey Baptist Grammar School
Cooper Vuna - St Patrick Ballarat
Laurie Weeks - Scotch College
Jason Woodward - Trinity Grammar

Field 1
8:30 Xavier College v Ivanhoe Grammar
8:45 St Peters Adelaide v St Kevins College 2
9:00 Carey Grammar v The Hutchins School
9:15 Trinity Grammar v Melbourne Grammar 3
9:30 St Kevin's College v St Peters Adelaide (under 16s)
9:45 Scotch College v Westall Secondary (under 16s)
10:00 St Francis Xavier v Melbourne Grammar 2
10:15 Melbourne High School v Trinity Grammar 2
10:30 Mentone Grammar v Xavier College (under 16s)
10:45 Melbourne Grammar v St Francis Xavier (under 16s)
11:00 St Kevin's College v Marcellin College
11:15 Xavier College 2 v Melbourne Grammar
11:30 The Hutchins School v Westall Secondary (under 16s)
11:45 Melbourne Grammar 2 v St Peters Adelaide (under 16s)
12:00 Xavier College v Carey Grammar
12:15 St Peters Adelaide v Trinity Grammar
12:30 The Hutchins School v Ivanhoe Grammar
12:45 Melbourne Grammar 3 v St Kevin's College

Field 2
8:30 St Francis Xavier v Marcellin College
8:45 Melbourne High School v Melbourne Grammar
9:00 St Kevin's College v Melbourne Grammar 2
9:15 Xavier College 2 v Trinity Grammar 2
9:30 Mentone Grammar v St Kevin's College 2
9:45 Melbourne Grammar v Xavier College 2
10:00 Xavier College v The Hutchins School
10:15 St Peters Adelaide v Melbourne Grammar 3
10:30 St Kevin's College v Melbourne Grammar 2
10:45 Scotch College v The Hutchins School
11:00 Carey Grammar v Ivanhoe Grammar
11:15 Trinity Grammar v St Kevins College 2
11:30 St Francis Xavier v Xavier College 2
11:45 Xavier College v St Kevin's College 2
12:00 St Francis Xavier v St Kevin's College
12:15 Melbourne High v Xavier College 2
12:30 Melbourne Grammar 2 v Marcellin College
12:45 Trinity Grammar v Melbourne Grammar

1:00 Lunch Time

Finals will be played from 1:20 - 3:40pm, and presentations will commence from 4:00.
 

Dumbledore

Dick Tooth (41)
I feel a bit sad that you lads don't have the provincialism as part of your rugby culture. Say you don't need it all you want, but it makes the victories that much sweeter. Especially when you know a few of the blokes playing because you came up playing with or against them.
Meh. It's just not an option at the moment and it's silly to assume otherwise. Twenty, thirty, years down the track when there's actually history to care about then sure.

Colby is a fucking great signing. Couldn't be happier we've got him.

PAE, Lahiff, Pyle, Neville, Jones, Fainga'a, Higgers... that's a young and seriously talented forward pack. If we can get our hands on decent hooker and coach, there's no reason not to expect big improvements next season.
 

kronic

John Solomon (38)
Urghhh. Can't be bothered reading the previous posts. Makes me want to bag my head against desk.

The Growden rumour file mentions Nucifora for the job next season. F**k that, I'm out.

Laurie Fisher, should be top of the list.
 

Dumbledore

Dick Tooth (41)
Urghhh. Can't be bothered reading the previous posts. Makes me want to bag my head against desk.

The Growden rumour file mentions Nucifora for the job next season. F**k that, I'm out.

Laurie Fisher, should be top of the list.
Why? It's actually a pretty interesting discussion about how the Rebels should move forward as a franchise.

Completely with you on Nucifora though. I'll seriously reconsider a membership if he's made coach.
 

swingpass

Peter Sullivan (51)
On another note some Rebels in action this week

VRU
Southern districts - Shota Horie
Quins - Reid and Rokobaro
Powerhouse - Hegarty
Melb Uni - Tom English

Shute Shield
Syd Uni - Tim Davidson
Manly - Eddie Aholelei and Pat Leafa

great to see, but where are the others ? thomson, king, sitauti, ah-nau, dyer are they playing for a club somewhere
(stirzaker and roberts could do with a run also !)
 
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