$1 million Rugby Revolution

[WorkingClassRugger]

Yep in Queensland this model definitely failed. Have teams such as Souths, Easts and Sunnybank being represented by a team based on the Gold Coast was never going to work. It would be like Manly people being expected to support their club players playing for Central Coast.

I think the next attempt still needs to include one team from Perth, Melbourne and Canberra no matter what. Then I would pick the strongest most financially viable clubs from QLD and NSW

How many club would be able to compete as stand alone entities in such a competition? Not too many I would suggest.

The ARC failed more due to poor administration than a couple of poorly (really poorly) named teams. I agree with the sentiment though, in time and hopefully sooner than later, this model would quickly move to include teams from the ACT, Melbourne and Perth.

 

[kronic]

Clearly some forumites don't understand the concept of a context. By ARC model, I was referring to the teams, not the organizational model and funding structures.

 

[East Coast Aces]

How many club would be able to compete as stand alone entities in such a competition? Not too many I would suggest.

The ARC failed more due to poor administration than a couple of poorly (really poorly) named teams. I agree with the sentiment though, in time and hopefully sooner than later, this model would quickly move to include teams from the ACT, Melbourne and Perth.

They wouldn't be standing on their own 2 feat. They would have access to the same funding some people are suggesting for these start up teams.

From the sounds of what has been offically stated by the article and the Balmain club themselves there are a number of clubs and financial backers out there, who can get behind current clubs.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

But the travel was one of the leading reasons the ARC sunk. Flying 25 blokes across the Nullabour and back every week is not a recipe for fiscal stability, sadly.

Livingstone is on the money in this regard- keep it on the Eastern seaboard to begin with, and bring in WA and VIC in a few years once the comp is on its feet.
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Agreed. Though, it would be good to see one of the 6 Sydney team's replaced by a ACT squad. I really don't think that'd be too much of Livingstone has even mentioned that this is purely just to kick it off and that in time they definitely want teams from the ACT, Melbourne and Perth to become involved. In fact, I think 6 teams in Brisbane may be three to many. So if this proves successful it could be worthwhile to move it to a more unified schedule beyond it preliminary concept then perhaps three of those Brisbane teams could be replaced by new teams from each of those areas.

 

[East Coast Aces]

But the travel was one of the leading reasons the ARC sunk. Flying 25 blokes across the Nullabour and back every week is not a recipe for fiscal stability, sadly.

Livingstone is on the money in this regard- keep it on the Eastern seaboard to begin with, and bring in WA and VIC in a few years once the comp is on its feet.
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Maybe it could start as a 2 week carnival similar to the Schoolboy championships. And grow it that way, in length of competition rather then grow in terms of number of teams and players and coaches. This way we develop a large number of players and coaches and they are put under a microscope to work out who can jump to the next level.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

They wouldn't be standing on their own 2 feat. They would have access to the same funding some people are suggesting for these start up teams.

From the sounds of what has been offically stated by the article and the Balmain club themselves there are a number of clubs and financial backers out there, who can get behind current clubs.

If some clubs were to identify and approach some of these investors and all parties agree then sure, there's no reason why they couldn't compete. I personally wouldn't have too much of an issue with that. However, the impression I got from the articles I've read on this proposal it just doesn't seem to be what they are aiming for and something more akin to the ARC teams (district based) are what they are looking to achieve. And if they do manage to get it up and running with FTA exposure, it could prove successful.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

Maybe it could start as a 2 week carnival similar to the Schoolboy championships. And grow it that way, in length of competition rather then grow in terms of number of teams and players and coaches. This way we develop a large number of players and coaches and they are put under a microscope to work out who can jump to the next level.

As opposed to the 5 weeks in Livingstone's proposal? I'd take the 5 weeks.

 

[TOCC]

Clearly some forumites don't understand the concept of a context. By ARC model, I was referring to the teams, not the organizational model and funding structures.

That's actually not what you said...

Regardless the club model 'teams' was shocking, alienating existing fans, sponsors, infrastructure and clubs... It was never going to work..

Sydney clubs were having fan days to to coincide with ARC matches and the clubs in QLD had zero support...

Rebels and Spirit were the only two decent clubs, but that's because they didn't have club rugby to compete with.

 

[barbarian]

Maybe it could start as a 2 week carnival similar to the Schoolboy championships. And grow it that way, in length of competition rather then grow in terms of number of teams and players and coaches. This way we develop a large number of players and coaches and they are put under a microscope to work out who can jump to the next level.

But then you are left with the cost of housing 30 blokes from WA for a two week period, plus the associated travel costs.

As much as I would love to see WA representation, it just can't happen initially.
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[East Coast Aces]

But then you are left with the cost of housing 30 blokes from WA for a two week period, plus the associated travel costs.

As much as I would love to see WA representation, it just can't happen initially.
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Put them all in Backpackers haha.

But perhaps they could do it in the September holidays and use school boarding facilities. This is just my temporary option to get the comp going, not long term. I just believe we should have it truely national first then expand the length. But also I believe we can reduce costs and improve the standard of the players by gaining efficiencies from using existing super rugby resources of the Force, Rebels and Brumbies. This would also see the reintroduction of academies.

 

[Braveheart81]

The idea though is to create a new product that will have interest from a TV partner.

Having a double header on a Friday night is far more likely to attract TV interest (from Ten or someone) than a carnival type event that takes place over a couple of weekend for entire days.

 

[East Coast Aces]

The idea though is to create a new product that will have interest from a TV partner.

Having a double header on a Friday night is far more likely to attract TV interest (from Ten or someone) than a carnival type event that takes place over a couple of weekend for entire days.

I know he isn't the most reliable source but Growden has written an article questioning the merrit going head to head with AFL and NRL. It would be interesting to see the actual TV figures from Saturday night.

I am not putting up the White flag here against NRL and AFL but maybe we should be looking at opportunities rather then going directly Head to Head with a rival competition much bigger. A Guerrilla warfare tactic of sorts.

Outside of NRL finals Live Rugby League is absent from FTA on Saturdays and Sundays. This I would see as a better option then Friday Night Rugby. Particularly with Rugbys supporter base being traditionally inner city professionals. Friday Night is not usually spent in front of the TV. More likely post work drinks or Date night.

 

[WorkingClassRugger]

I know he isn't the most reliable source but Growden has written an article questioning the merrit going head to head with AFL and NRL. It would be interesting to see the actual TV figures from Saturday night.

I am not putting up the White flag here against NRL and AFL but maybe we should be looking at opportunities rather then going directly Head to Head with a rival competition much bigger. A Guerrilla warfare tactic of sorts.

Outside of NRL finals Live Rugby League is absent from FTA on Saturdays and Sundays. This I would see as a better option then Friday Night Rugby. Particularly with Rugbys supporter base being traditionally inner city professionals. Friday Night is not usually spent in front of the TV. More likely post work drinks or Date night.

I'd have thought that Saturday would be the best choice. However, if timed right the overlap could be minimal. If they start it in late September they may find no competition (as in the last week in September) with the GF of both the AFL and NRL on the weekend.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Put them all in Backpackers haha.

But perhaps they could do it in the September holidays and use school boarding facilities. ...snip...

Put them up in Randwick or Holswothy Army Barracks. Put them under canvas if the accommodation is full.

Borrow the Army Tents and put them in the middle of Randwick Racecourse. They can jog from there to Moore Park to train as their warm up/cool down.

This will be a good way for them to get some HTFU, and for them to realise that they have a job as a professional/part time professional/aspirant professional rugby player because some Australian Family is prepared to stump up some of their post tax disposable income to watch them ply their trade.

 

[Dam0]

I don't really agree with the people who are asking "why did the ARC fail?" It didn't fail. The ARU cut it short after it had the inevitable loss in its teething years.

AIUI, the competition lost $4.7m in the first year and projections were that it would lose another $3m in the next year. Well of course. It take money to set this stuff up, and surely the ARU must realise, as the has the NZRU, that you use the big money events (tests mainly + Super XV) to pay for all the community stuff, like a regional tournament. Looking at the crowd figures for the first and only year of the ARC they were pretty dire, but they would have improved as the competition went on, and it got more exposure and sponsorship. Of course the teams are going to seem contrived to start off with, they're new bloody teams after all. This new tournament if it gets underway will also underperform in its first couple of years. I think there are horrible issues with the format as it is currently proposed but that is natural. The issue is whether the people who are supposed to be looking after the good of the game will perform their duty.

What the hell is the point of earning $45m in a World Cup if you aren't going to actually spend it on the game?

 

[TOCC]

Dam0, the competiton failed to draw respectable crowds, attract sponsors or receive any significant sponsorship and was inevitably cut... I'd say that's a failure, regardless of whether it had longer term potential...

Rebels were successful but ultimately they suffered the biggest finacial loss(underwritten by the ARU)..

I'm 100% supportive of a 3rd tier comp, but not in the format or structure which the ARC was run...

I'm all for sustainable development, utilizing existing resources for development in new areas... How about we examine the two most successful professional sporting competitions in Australia and the roots from which they were formed and how that translates to Rugby Union.. VFL/NSWRL anyone?

 

[Dam0]

Dam0, the competiton failed to draw respectable crowds, attract sponsors or receive any significant sponsorship and was inevitably cut. I'd say that's a failure, regardless of whether it had longer term potential.

Alright and you have taken the view that the ARU obviously did. I just can't help but think that spending some money to get a competition off the ground is the purpose of a rugby union.

Just as an aside, I'll bet you aren't aware of the clause in the NZRU constitution that says that they exist solely for the promotion of the amateur enjoyment of rugby. They may promote professional competitions only as a means to promote the amateur and community side of the game. That's right, according to the NZRU constitution anyway, the only participate in professional rugby to improve the state of amateur rugby. It puts the losing of a million or so on the ITM Cup each year into its proper perspective. They view it as their duty to ensure that there is a viable tournament to promote rugby within the provinces and are prepared to spend some money to do it.

Obviously some concern needs to be had for finances, which is where I think this model has its pluses. A conference in Sydney and a conference in Brisbane will cut down dramatically on the need for travel and all the expenses associated with it (airfares and hotel bills).

 

[kronic]

That's actually not what you said.

 

[nomis]

I think aiming for a tweaked ARC model, but starting smaller and more concentrated geographically is the way to go.

I would start with 8 teams, divided into 2 confernences. The geographical locations (though not necessarily their names) would be:

North Harbour
South Harbour
Western Sydney
Canberra

Brisbane North
Brisbane South
Gold Coast
Sunshine Coast

The existing clubs in each district/region (or close to it) would align with an ARC team.

A team would play home and away with the other teams in their conference (six games) and the top two from each conference would move thru to cross-over semis and a final (8 weeks total)

 

[H...]

Looking at the crowd figures for the first and only year of the ARC they were pretty dire, but they would have improved as the competition went on.

Would they?