2014 IRB Junior World Championship – New Zealand

[swingpass]

I had not looked at the format of this comp before.
Can someone help me?
Does missing a bonus point from the England game cost Australia?
Ireland won't lose to Fiji so we will finish 3rd of the 3rd placed teams - making us 9th seed meaning if we win Match 20 the highest we can finish is 9th. Who are we likely to draw for that game?
So 10th beckons? (which no doubt stuffs our draw for 2015).
NZ cannot finish higher than 5th unless there is a boil over in a pool match.
Or have i missed something?

yes you have
only three pools, we have to finish top of the pool "runners up" to progress.
so we rely on wales beating france and us beating italy by a lot more than the baby blacks beat scotland is how i see it

 

[Braveheart81]

I think we need to look at what a successful tournament for us is and gauge the outcome on that. After following this level of rugby for a number of years success for Australia is having boys from the right schools representing us, so we can stand in the old school bars and tell each other how well our schools have done. On a positive note, the CEO got his son in from 2XV Colts so can't all be bad. The boys who played today have never beaten England at any age group yet we persist with the same selection processes. Let hope we can arrest the decay before the fabric of junior rugby has totally gone.

Isn't this the first year under an entirely different selection process by having a national tournament?

I think your comment might be true in previous years but no longer is accurate.

Sent from my HTC_PN071 using Tapatalk

 

[Inside Shoulder]

yes you have
only three pools, we have to finish top of the pool "runners up" to progress.
so we rely on wales beating france and us beating italy by a lot more than the baby blacks beat scotland is how i see it

Quite - ever the optimist I had us finishing 3rd in our pool.
so the non bonus point v england may be costly

 

[waiopehu oldboy]

Standings after last night:

A
Team W D L PTS
England 2 0 0 10
Australia 1 0 1 5
Italy. 1 0 1 4
Argentina 0 0 2 1
B
Team W D L PTS
France 2 0 0 9
Ireland 1 0 1 6
Wales 1 0 1 5
Fiji. 0 0 2 0
C
Team. W D L PTS
South Africa 2 0 0 10
New Zealand 1 0 1 5
Samoa. 1 0 1 4
Scotland. 0. 0 2 0

Matches remaining are Australia v Italy, England v Argentina; Ireland v Fiji, France v Wales; and NZ v Scotland, SA v Samoa.

Ireland looking good for 4th unless the Samoans can somehow derail the Seths. Hard to believe that after dominating the comp for so long NZ most likely won't even make the semis. Obviously we're not feeding our kids enough red meat & (sweet) potatoes!

 

[tranquility]

It doesn't matter how good he has been. One error cost us a try which would've netted 2 points and kept us in the tournament. No need to sugarcoat it, it's reality.

He has debuted for the Reds?
Don't put words in my mouth.
I said it was worthy of comment.
I blamed him for nothing more than hubris.
If someone posts the incident you will be embarrassed for defending it.
I actually hope he plays for the Reds for a decade.

Seriously, both of this stuff is pretty disappointing / grubby. I'm not sure that either of you is better than this, but I think the forum is better than this. Especially when watching players, who are all still teenagers.

 

[Dan54]

I missed the baby Wallabies/Poms yesterday but saw the Bok/AB game and by sounds of it Poms are right up there with Saffas. Although in no way downplaying how good the players obviously are in both teams, I think it shows also that time together is going to always help strengthen your team patterns, Baby Boks been together 2 months and with majority of team being in Bulls academy, is surely going to help team structures etc, same as NH teams have just finished 6N U20 tournament, so would I imagine have great structure etc in place. As I say they obviously got bloody good players, and with experience together will always make these teams very strong, I think not getting to upset over the NZRU (of ARU) not being prepared to put a lot of money in too longer camps etc, as team is basically picked to come together for the one comp in a year, then disband and it almost a complete new team next year. To really make a difference you would need a Sanzar U20 comp every year, and not sure whether that is best place to spend development money.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Pool A
02 Jun, 13:35 Argentina 17-36 Australia
02 Jun, 17:35 England 63-3 Italy
06 Jun, 15:35 Argentina 26-29 Italy
06 Jun, 17:35 England 38-24 Australia

To Come
10 Jun, 15:35 Australia v Italy, ECOLight Stadium, Pukekohe
10 Jun, 17:35 England v Argentina, QBE Stadium, Auckland


Pool B
02 Jun, 15:35 Wales 48-19 Fiji
02 Jun, 17:35 France 19-13 Ireland
06 Jun, 15:35 France 37-5 Fiji
06 Jun, 17:35 Wales 21-35 Ireland

To Come
10 Jun, 13:35 Ireland v Fiji, QBE Stadium, Auckland
10 Jun, 15:35 Wales v France, QBE Stadium, Auckland

Pool C
02 Jun, 15:35 South Africa 61-5 Scotland
02 Jun, 19:35 New Zealand 48-12 Samoa
06 Jun, 13:35 Scotland 18-27 Samoa
06 Jun, 19:35 New Zealand 24-33 South Africa

To Come
10 Jun, 17:35 Samoa v South Africa, ECOLight Stadium, Pukekohe
10 Jun, 19:35 New Zealand v Scotland, ECOLight Stadium, Pukekohe

 

[Redmond]

I think we need to look at what a successful tournament for us is and gauge the outcome on that. After following this level of rugby for a number of years success for Australia is having boys from the right schools representing us, so we can stand in the old school bars and tell each other how well our schools have done. On a positive note, the CEO got his son in from 2XV Colts so can't all be bad. The boys who played today have never beaten England at any age group yet we persist with the same selection processes. Let hope we can arrest the decay before the fabric of junior rugby has totally gone.

I must agree although there are players out there who could contribute and be successful at that level. Unfortunately they play for the wrong club, have the wrong post code and attended the wrong school.

 

[Hugh Jarse]

Who are these awesome players that have been overlooked?

Name a better halfback than Angus Pulver.

Suggestions that he is there because of Servo being the CEO is as insulting to the Coach and Selectors as it would be claiming that Cameron Clark is in the Sevens squad because his father is the head commentator for Fox.

By all accounts, the selection and trial process this year has been very thorough.

Plenty of kids without Aust Schoolboy Rockstar CV's have made it into the squad on their talent and application rather than reputation.

 

[ld2b]

Absolutely agree HJ. The inference that some boys in the squad owe their position to the influence of their family is insulting to the selectors and coach who put in a huge effort to be prepared for this year's tournament.

Unfortunately, we simply have to accept the reality that Australian teams are as good as they can be given the various alternative, very lucrative, pathways that young men can follow these days.

 

[Forcefield]

The positives for the Wallabies are that the last two years have seen two very good THPs for Australia U20s (Hoskins, Ala'alatoa).

 

[redhead]

Common guys. Stop complaining. We had much better preparation this year, picked the best team, but to be honest only in my dreams I hoped that our boys will make semifinals. I am happy with the way they are playing. They cant match the best yet but be patient they will get there. Some further changes to preparation (longer camp, more games) may be still needed. Watching them this year I am optimistic for 2015 in Italy.

 

[Forcefield]

That is why I have said NRC needs U20 and grade, yeah I want to watch 2 games but it will assist in development.

I reckon a few talented 19 year olds will be playing in the NRC. I think that is enough. A big help would be a home and away series against the U20 NZ side.

 

[The Raging Potato]

Name a better halfback than Angus Pulver.

Fabian Natoli

 

[ld2b]

A

Fabian Natoli

An excellent half back. I think the point if the question was to nominate a half back who didn't get an opportunity to be seen by the relevant selectors.

 

[Iluvmyfooty]

I don't think it's game time or a better selection process that is needed. We have the skills and drive to match it with England and SA. Where they do better is the physical and mental development of players from 16 years on. The English players are taken into professional club framework from 16 and given the type of physical development that now sees them bigger and stronger than Oz players at the same age. Yesterday's game reminded me if the game a couple of years ago where an English U18/19 side came here and did a job on our schoolboys and an Oz u19 side . The improvement from then to now by our boys is very promising but until we look at physical development and bringing them into some sort of professional framework from under 16 I don't think we will compete at this level.

The same for SA. It was said during the NZ v SA game that 19 of the squad of 30 came from the Bulls Academy. I bet those players have been there for more than 2 or 3 years

 

[Lee Grant]

I wrote about the game here:

http://www.greenandgoldrugby.com/england-under-20s-too-good-for-aussies/

… and have a little rant in Discussion at the bottom, which bears on the subject.
.

 

[Brian Westlake]

Most of them are.. which ones don't you approve of and name a replacement.

1. Rory O'Connor - Would be out of his depth in a puddle. Put Tom Robertson in and he can play both sides of the scrum.
2. Harry Scoble - At what stage the politics of State leave National. In Hooker You have to be able to scrummage and throw. He can't. Tevita Vea
4. Tom Staniforth - Not fit. Put Dempsey in there and make him work.
7. Rowan Perry - Again, how long can favour carry you through? Whilst in the Brumbies blanket he seems to have not developed ala Michael Hooper. Michael Gunn in a nutshell. Battle hardened from grade. Jack Johnson who is smaller than Perry, but faster, stronger over the ball and in the last couple of minutes of play would get the ball to the ground. Not get held up by an inside back.
Should I speak about the backs?

The politics of player rotation etc means Jack Shit when you don't get through the pool

 

[It is what it is]

Which is what it is, isn't it?
...snip.....?

Bit of respect please IS on the pronunciation of my name.

 

[Dave Beat]

A
An excellent half back. I think the point if the question was to nominate a half back who didn't get an opportunity to be seen by the relevant selectors.

And Fabian curved it up today in grade.