VRU 2012

[pablo]

Oh, something you guys might be interested in.

I heard that a model quite similar to the one I suggested is being implemented (except with 4 Prems grades). Also that Uni is not a relegation risk.

Could be 3rd hand information that bares no resemblance to the truth, or it could be Boroondara/E.Hills that are getting the flick.

Yeah I've got it on the hook that Uni aren't going to be relegated, meet too many criteria (3+ senior teams, colts, good administration, etc). Add in the fact they sponsor the Rebels and have the scholarship program that is run through the Uni's sports section and you can't see them going anywhere. Boroondara are in trouble, dare I say it that Box Hill or Endeavour Hills might be the other??

 

[elementfreak]

Wouldn't assume anything. Souths will fold to Footscray from what we have seen in the past month or so, House v Quins will be a game and a half.last week was just a warm up. House had 2 tries not even considered and 2 held up, Quins were on the rope for a long time in that game and held on, going to be a great game in the mud at Holmesglen!

Might have to head down to watch it if I can.

 

[en_force_er]

Yeah I've got it on the hook that Uni aren't going to be relegated, meet too many criteria (3+ senior teams, colts, good administration, etc). Add in the fact they sponsor the Rebels and have the scholarship program that is run through the Uni's sports section and you can't see them going anywhere. Boroondara are in trouble, dare I say it that Box Hill or Endeavour Hills might be the other??

You'd imagine EHills will go, BH never perform too well but they also don't often drop into the bottom 3.

Also I've heard they're deciding on the drop based on more than just 2012 results but results over a certain number of years (you'd presume 2).

 

[FiveStarStu]

Full schedule for Saturday:

AT HARLEQUIN: Holmesglen Reserve, Power Avenue, Ashwood

Colts SF 3v4 11.15am
Melbourne v Endeavour Hills
---
2nd Grade QF 4v5 1.30pm
Power House v Endeavour Hills
---
1st Grade QF 3v6 3.10pm
Harlequin v Power House
---
Colts SF 1v2 4.50pm
Melbourne University v Harlequin

AT FOOTSCRAY: Henry Turner Memorial Reserve, Farnsworth St, Footscray

3rd Grade QF 3v6 10.15am
Power House v Footscray
---
3rd Grade QF 4v5 11.45am
Moorabbin v Melbourne University
---
2nd Grade QF 3v6 1.15pm
Moorabbin v Footscray
---
1st Grade QF 4v5 3.00pm
Footscray v Southern Districts

AT NORTHERN: CH Sullivan Memorial Park, Reservoir

Women 1v2 12.00pm
Power House v Northern
---
Women 3v4 1.30pm
Box Hill v Endeavour Hills
---
2A Grade 1 v 2 3.00pm
Northern v Wyndham City

AT ELTHAM: Pitt St Rugby Field, Eltham

2B Grade 3 v 4 1.30pm
Melbourne v Geelong
---
2A Grade 3 v 4 3.00pm
Eltham v Geelong

AT MONASH: Monash Uni Oval, Wellington Rd, Clayton

2A Grade 1 v 2 3.00pm
Monash University v Maroondah

AT BORDER ARMY: Lord Oval, Bandiana Barracks, Bandiana

Country 1v2 3.00pm
Border Army v Puckapunyal

AT BENDIGO: Epsom Huntley Recreation Reserve, Epsom

Country 3v4 3.00pm
Bendigo v Deniliquin

 

[elementfreak]

You'd imagine EHills will go, BH never perform too well but they also don't often drop into the bottom 3.

Also I've heard they're deciding on the drop based on more than just 2012 results but results over a certain number of years (you'd presume 2).

They seem to do alright, last 3 years they have made the finals in 1sts each year with their 2nd making a final and their 3rds making the finals last year.

 

[pablo]

They seem to do alright, last 3 years they have made the finals in 1sts each year with their 2nd making a final and their 3rds making the finals last year.

This the same club that plays 1st grade players in 3rd grade and then struggles to field 2nds? Short memories, they look like they've sorted it out but if you're going over 2 years, maybe 3, then the VRU will have this noted.

What would make it easier is is the VRU just told us what is going on....stop speculation and the like for good!

 

[elementfreak]

This the same club that plays 1st grade players in 3rd grade and then struggles to field 2nds? Short memories, they look like they've sorted it out but if you're going over 2 years, maybe 3, then the VRU will have this noted.

What would make it easier is is the VRU just told us what is going on..stop speculation and the like for good!

If you spoke to the coach what they were doing made sense. They were playing 1st grade players who were named on the bench for the 1st grade game in 3rd grade to make sure they still had match fitness even though they were only getting 20 minutes in the 1st grade game.

 

[en_force_er]

They seem to do alright, last 3 years they have made the finals in 1sts each year with their 2nd making a final and their 3rds making the finals last year.

I'd be interested to see the ladders to prove this but I'll take it at face value. "Making the finals" by coming 6th in a 10 team league is hardly glorious.

If you spoke to the coach what they were doing made sense. They were playing 1st grade players who were named on the bench for the 1st grade game in 3rd grade to make sure they still had match fitness even though they were only getting 20 minutes in the 1st grade game.

It's not imoral but it's silly. One only needs to play a 3rd grade game to realise other than the top 3-4 teams it's a pretty low standard.

 

[elementfreak]

I'd be interested to see the ladders to prove this but I'll take it at face value. "Making the finals" by coming 6th in a 10 team league is hardly glorious.

No it's hardly glamorous but I was merely commenting that other teams (uni, boroondara, EH) haven't made the finals as regularly as Box Hill.

It's not imoral but it's silly. One only needs to play a 3rd grade game to realise other than the top 3-4 teams it's a pretty low standard.

Agreed.



At the end of the day whatever the VRU decide to do next year I hope it is better than what we have at the moment and ideally it will be. A premier grade of Melbourne, Quins, Moorabbin, Footscray, House, Uni, Box Hill and Souths would, on paper, seem to be a strong competition with only 1 or 2 "easy" games.
I assume we would go back to the 4 team finals system as well, which IMO is a better way of doing it.

 

[en_force_er]

No it's hardly glamorous but I was merely commenting that other teams (uni, boroondara, EH) haven't made the finals as regularly as Box Hill.

At the end of the day whatever the VRU decide to do next year I hope it is better than what we have at the moment and ideally it will be. A premier grade of Melbourne, Quins, Moorabbin, Footscray, House, Uni, Box Hill and Souths would, on paper, seem to be a strong competition with only 1 or 2 "easy" games.
I assume we would go back to the 4 team finals system as well, which IMO is a better way of doing it.

As long as the VRU allow for a clear promotion relegation pathway (i.e. winner of 2nd Div plays loser of Prems over 2 games in the preseason) then nobody can argue a league change up is unfair.

Personally I like the finals system of 1v2, 3v4... winner of 3v4 players loser of 1v2, then the 2 teams still standing play. It really rewards finishing 1 or 2. Then again, one could argue there's no clear advantage of finishing 1 over 2.

 

[elementfreak]

As long as the VRU allow for a clear promotion relegation pathway (i.e. winner of 2nd Div plays loser of Prems over 2 games in the preseason) then nobody can argue a league change up is unfair.

Personally I like the finals system of 1v2, 3v4. winner of 3v4 players loser of 1v2, then the 2 teams still standing play. It really rewards finishing 1 or 2. Then again, one could argue there's no clear advantage of finishing 1 over 2.

With 6 teams 1 and 2 get a week off but we could still see a grand final between 5 and 6 which doesn't happen in the 4 team finals system as it assures spot 1 or 2 with a place in the final, thus rewarding them for being up the top come the end of the normal season.

 

[kronic]

Eltham hosting a home semi

 

[en_force_er]

Eltham hosting a home semi

If Eltham establish a colts team in 2013 and continue current growth they might be a Prems team one day.

If you were them you'd:

• Try to get another school playing rugby in the catchment area (perhaps Assumption College?) on top of Ivanhoe Grammar (it may take away 1-2 players a year but it'd 3-4 post schooling if well managed).
• Create a concrete association with tertiary institutions (latrobe's main campus and a reasonably sized rmit are nearby).
• Get their 2nd field permanently committed to the club.

 

[kronic]

On the last note, the matches this Saturday are being played on the 2nd ground, as the main field has been ruled out for the season.

 

[pablo]

It's not imoral but it's silly. One only needs to play a 3rd grade game to realise other than the top 3-4 teams it's a pretty low standard.

Makes no sense but does make a complete mockery of the 2nd grade competition. Pretty happy that they ended up not winning the 3rd grade comp as (nearly) every other club in the comp fills from top to bottom and ensures that the higher levels of competition are supported.

As for the finals, having more than half of the competition involved is stupid. Of the teams that came 6th this season in P1-3 none have a winning record or a winning percentage. Now you are in the situation, using P1 as an example, where House can string 3 good games together, knock off Quins, Melbourne and whoever makes it on the other side of the draw and win the GF....Of course I'd love to see it happen but it isn't the best finals system going around.

 

[elementfreak]

Makes no sense but does make a complete mockery of the 2nd grade competition. Pretty happy that they ended up not winning the 3rd grade comp as (nearly) every other club in the comp fills from top to bottom and ensures that the higher levels of competition are supported.

Agreed, although I can remember a few years ago when Melbourne and Boroondara played in the P3 grand final and Boroondara had one of the 1st grade props playing in the game as he had qualified by playing 3rd grade all year IIRC.

As for the finals, having more than half of the competition involved is stupid. Of the teams that came 6th this season in P1-3 none have a winning record or a winning percentage. Now you are in the situation, using P1 as an example, where House can string 3 good games together, knock off Quins, Melbourne and whoever makes it on the other side of the draw and win the GF..Of course I'd love to see it happen but it isn't the best finals system going around.

The 4 team system works a lot better IMO.

 

[pablo]

Agreed, although I can remember a few years ago when Melbourne and Boroondara played in the P3 grand final and Boroondara had one of the 1st grade props playing in the game as he had qualified by playing 3rd grade all year IIRC.

That's why is said nearly all of the other clubs. Boroondara played their last round in 2009 or 2010 (can't remeber which) with a full 3rds team + reserves, made most of them back up for 2nds and then started their 1sts with 12 players. They eventually got to 13 or 14 but only as the coach ended up playing....think the score in 1sts was 94 or 96 nil, and their 3rds made it through and won the GF IIRC.

 

[elementfreak]

That's why is said nearly all of the other clubs. Boroondara played their last round in 2009 or 2010 (can't remeber which) with a full 3rds team + reserves, made most of them back up for 2nds and then started their 1sts with 12 players. They eventually got to 13 or 14 but only as the coach ended up playing..think the score in 1sts was 94 or 96 nil, and their 3rds made it through and won the GF IIRC.

They didn't win the GF, Melbourne got it thanks to a penalty try. That was the year that Melbourne won 5 out of 5 IIRC.

 

[pablo]

They didn't win the GF, Melbourne got it thanks to a penalty try. That was the year that Melbourne won 5 out of 5 IIRC.

You've got your years mixed up, Boroondara beat House in the 3rds in 2009, Melbourne beat Boroondara (and everyone else in all other grades) in 2010. Not many other clubs have done this in Oz, I know Wests in Canberra did it....

 

[elementfreak]

You've got your years mixed up, Boroondara beat House in the 3rds in 2009, Melbourne beat Boroondara (and everyone else in all other grades) in 2010. Not many other clubs have done this in Oz, I know Wests in Canberra did it..

Oh right, my mistake. I remember the 1st grade prop playing in the 2010 final as well.