Wallabies 2023

[Highlander35]

The form Australian super rugby 8 is not suited to 8...

While I have no opinion one way or another on Gleeson, you conventionally see a lot of players play roles at lower levels that you would not have them play conventionally at higher ones, because of a variety of reasons: internal team balance, player availability, reduced requirement to fit to conventional roles etc. Dickie Hardwick has played all of his starts at 8 this season: but playing for a Tier 1 (or whatever they're called nowadays) nation, you'd never expect him to play anything but 7. There are a lot of International "6s/Blindsides" you see playing lock at Provincial/Regional/Franchise rugby. And you see this all the time with high quality wingers at club/school/age grade level where many will play Fullback or outside center to get more involved in the game. One to one correlations between positions don't always work since the requirements, both as a unit and as individuals are at different standards for different levels.

 

[Braveheart81]

I really could not disagree with that more.

He hits hard and runs hard, he ain't about smart, he is about hitting hard and running hard - that is his point of difference

I'm with qwerty here. Gleeson certainly runs hard and goes full speed into contact but he has also ghosted through plenty of holes this season by running a really good line.

 

[cyclopath]

I'm with qwerty here. Gleeson certainly runs hard and goes full speed into contact but he has also ghosted through plenty of holes this season by running a really good line.

Not sure anything that size with a bright red hat can be accused of "ghosting".

 

[qwerty51]

While I have no opinion one way or another on Gleeson, you conventionally see a lot of players play roles at lower levels that you would not have them play conventionally at higher ones, because of a variety of reasons: internal team balance, player availability, reduced requirement to fit to conventional roles etc.

Case in point, Holloway has been one of the form locks in Super Rugby and is next to no chance of ever playing a Test at lock. He's going to play in the wider channels for the Wallabies, not having to scrum will open his running game even more.

 

[stillmissit]

I really could not disagree with that more.



You know he was a 7 right, he has the pilfering ability already, saw glimpses but that's not been his role at the Tahs - could easily be for the Wallabies though.

Qwerty, if you haven't heard, the modern idea in rugby is that all players need to be able to pilfer as you can't wait for the right guy to be there or turn up. I understand that many of you here have wraps on him and that was why I watched him to understand what you all saw in him, apart from a hard runner at the opposition. That is about all I see in him atm. Comparing him to Holloway at 8 when he arrived at the tahs from souths it is night and day. Sticking Holloway in the row was a huge loss to Aus rugby IMHO.
I'll stick to my opinion and hope to be proven wrong as we need a bigger 7 but I can't see him as an 8.

 

[stillmissit]

He hits hard and runs hard, he ain't about smart, he is about hitting hard and running hard - that is his point of difference

His work off the ball if fine, he is played wider for the Tahs so he can be less involved if the game plan doesn't work, but he works hard in the trenches

The over the ball skills? The Tahs play to hold play up trying to set up and close out mauls for turnovers. They are trying to slow up the tackle to allow the defence to spread

With that game plan, there is little planned over the ball stuff - the game plan doesn't have the chopped tackles with units diving for the ball planned for

Agree with the first line but I think the rest of your post points to one of the problems the Tahs have, and that is defensive re-alignment and the D generally. If the best way they can turn over the ball is to hold someone up then that's a tough trot involving several players with limited results once the opp knows you are going to do it.

 

[eastman]

Hard to find too much wrong with that. Petaia was on track for selection on the right wing before injury. Could argue Ryan Lonergan ahead of Jake Gordon.

I’m not sure that Jake Gordon is a better player than Ryan Lonergan (or Tate McDermott) but is he far more important to his team than the other individuals.

 

[wamberal]

I’m not sure that Jake Gordon is a better player than Ryan Lonergan (or Tate McDermott) but is he far more important to his team than the other individuals.

I don't like Gordon much as a player, but in a tight corner he is worth having. He won't win games. But he might save them.

 

[Slim 293]

I don't like Gordon much as a player, but in a tight corner he is worth having. He won't win games. But he might save them.

The Wallabies’ spring tour suggests otherwise…

 

[Members Section]

I don't like Gordon much as a player, but in a tight corner he is worth having. He won't win games. But he might save them.

he is literally the last of all the 9's in the country I want in a tight corner when the game is on the line

 

[fatprop]

I’m not sure that Jake Gordon is a better player than Ryan Lonergan (or Tate McDermott) but is he far more important to his team than the other individuals.

I think he is rather good, but not great, when he is on for the Tahs there is a clear team improvement, better structure, better kicking etc

I don't see the same qualities in Lonergan or McDermott - who Jones selects will be down to structure of the team.

We have been playing with the 9 running the game, doing a good load of tactical kicking and the 10 sitting in pocket looking for opportunities. The best two in that model are White (by daylight) and Gordon with Lonergan just behind

McDermott is a different style of 9 who I think will excel in the future with say Gordon at 10 who plays flatter and demands more of the ball, letting his sniping hold the drift

So if Jones wants/thinks the Cooper/Gordon nexus will be required to run more of the game, McDermott jumps up the pecking order, if Jones wants more strike weapons off the bench, McDermott jumps up the pecking order, but if he stays with a tight structure play ...................... i think there are better options

 

[RebelYell]

I see Gordon as a great cultural fit for those not in the matchday 23. Great 3rd choice scrumhalf.

 

[Adam84]

Gordon did some really stupid shit on the Spring Tour last year; he gave away soft penalties and stupid ones that really hurt the team. He is supposed to be an experienced player, but his actions on the field didn't reflect this.

 

[qwerty51]

Lonergan could very well find himself in the 23 on the back of his long place kicking range. I don't expect Gordon to make the squad.

 

[rugbyAU]

White, Mcdermott and Lonergan the 3 HB's for me

 

[eastman]

White, Mcdermott and Lonergan the 3 HB's for me

You guys are going to be fuming when Gordon inevitably gets selected in the squad.

I agree with RebelYell that he’s a good candidate as third choice halfback:, he is a known leader and a renowned strong trainer. He’s also fundamentally a better player than what he demonstrated in the last EOFY tour.

 

[Adam84]

You guys are going to be fuming when Gordon inevitably gets selected in the squad.

not really, just hold a different opinion based on performances we’ve witnessed

 

[eastman]

Lonergan could very well find himself in the 23 on the back of his long place kicking range. I don't expect Gordon to make the squad.

Is Lonergan the new Hodge!?

 

[qwerty51]

Is Lonergan the new Hodge!?

I think it's pretty likely one will play #21 or #23 purely for their long kicking ability..

 

[Jimmy_Crouch]

I think it's pretty likely one will play #21 or #23 purely for their long kicking ability..

What about Whitey?