Wallabies vs Ireland - 3rd test - Saturday 23rd June 2018 - Sydney Football Stadium

[Rock Lobster]

Did he get the ball??? In the second frame of your examples above it looks like POM's hand on the ball, not Folau's

 

[cyclopath]

Did he get the ball??? In the second frame of your examples above it looks like POM's hand on the ball, not Folau's

It got knocked back by Folau, or forward by POM and gathered by Aus, so yes. Sort of.

 

[Braveheart81]

Did he get the ball??? In the second frame of your examples above it looks like POM's hand on the ball, not Folau's

It may very briefly touch O'Mahony's hand but is then slapped back with force by Folau.

 

[K974]

M8 you are really shite at picking up sarcasm over text hey.

I get it man, you import all the best talent and the European Cup is much more watchable than it used to be.

This has NOTHING to do with the woes in Australian rugby, other than it contributes to the player drain. Stop harping on about the Champions Cup in the match thread.

Apologies I didn't get the sarcasm but the gist of my point is that the decline in super rugby is linked or the decline in the wallabies fortunes , likewise the improvement in champions cup is linked to ireland improvement

I'm a huge fan of Australian rugby drawn in by the 84 and 91 teams and since moving here become a bigger fan obviously other tha when playing ireland
I think it's an easy fix the super Comp
I think the talent is Incteible here given that the wallabies are always 2/3/4/5th world at any given time , I was just throwing out an opinion on one of the reasonings for the decline , I'd love to see wallabies back to where they belong at the very top
The comment might not be specific to the match but I think it's relevant to the series as a whole

 

[Lorenzo]

In particular. I remember joking with my brother when we were young about the Ella-Boot reflex, he kicked so much at times. History tends to mark guys like these as mercurial in their play, but apart from Campese's occasional moments of brilliance (and despair) they were all quite orthodox players in many ways - very good all-round skills of draw and pass, backing up and kicking.

No one has ever been consistent winners at test level playing the ball control offense. Not us (to add to your post, larkham was never shy of making territory with the boot), not the ABs, not the saffas (lol) and def not the northerners.

Reasons: its not possible to hold onto the pill consistently for more than 10 phases because of the natural contest for possession and the fact that defense at test level is a bigger step up from Soup than offense is.

Sadly, the art of kicking has been bred out of our game, thanks to the myth of running rugby and the influence of league.

 

[Rock Lobster]

Yeah fair enough but I believe my point is still valid in that by going up behind POM any contact is going to result in a dangerous situation. Chicken and egg stuff I know as POM could still have ended up in a dangerous position without Folau in the equation but that would mean they would have no one to blame but themselves.

 

[Derpus]

No one has ever been consistent winners at test level playing the ball control offense. Not us (to add to your post, larkham was never shy of making territory with the boot), not the ABs, not the saffas (lol) and def not the northerners.

Reasons: its not possible to hold onto the pill consistently for more than 10 phases because of the natural contest for possession and the fact that defense at test level is a bigger step up from Soup than offense is.

Sadly, the art of kicking has been bred out of our game, thanks to the myth of running rugby and the influence of league.

Geez Ireland give it a fair go though. Pretty effective i thought. Sure they kicked a bit, but they ran through phase ball a lot more.

 

[Braveheart81]

So it seems Folau was only issued a citing commissioner warning for the O'Mahony incident we've been discussing and therefore has a judiciary hearing on the back of a warning and a yellow card (which equals a red card).

On that basis I think it is one week maximum rather than being charged under a specific foul player charge and being judged based on the low end, mid range, high end gradings etc.

 

[Brumby Runner]

The question is how to do it though. Generally the kick is aimed for someone who is good in the air and has the advantage of a running leap for the ball whereas the defender can't make the ideal run and leap at the ball as they are under it to begin with.

Trying to call mark in a situation where you are already struggling to compete just makes your situation more difficult.

Maybe make it so the defender can call mark the moment the ball comes off the foot so it has least impact on their attempt to catch it but still gives them a mark if they are successful.




We'll see. It is pretty minor contact in the scheme of things. The problem is that the momentum of both players is going in the same direction. We see far greater incidental contact between two competing players when they are travelling in opposite directions and it is play on and not dangerous.

It will be interesting to see what world rugby does here and how strongly RA defend it.

BH I like your commitment to find any chink at all in the argument that Folau is to some larger extent than others responsible in those actions. But the contact on the ground of two players going in the opposite direction, say in a tackle situation, is that both players usually go to ground from a point where their legs are on the ground. One of them is not 2m in the air at the point of contact. In the Folau incidents, he did not contact the other player with such force as to cause injury, but he did destabilise the player in the air such that he landed in a manner that could have resulted in (quite severe) injury. No doubt, there was no intention, and no doubt the lifter was also partly responsible. But I will be very surprised if Izzy isn't found culpable of some offence, even if it just to not do anything that might be a danger to another player, and then be given a holiday for his efforts.

 

[Ignoto]

The only form of tactical kicking deemed acceptable to many of those who follow the game is the cross kick for the winger to score. Long kicks for territory are deemed unAustralian.

I dunno QH, as a boy I used to love watching Latho torpedo the fuck out of a ball at both Balleymore and Suncorp. Watching that ball spiral all the way between 22's was pure magic.

Ever since the Reds won the competition in 2011, Australians have been switched on that kicking is ok. BUT the kick needs to have a point to it. Kicking for the sake of kicking is where the general public gets shitty with. It also hasn't helped that our main kicker (Foley) can't kick, yet we see he's constantly persisted with.

You know who showed that he can kick on Saturday? Samu fucking Kerevi. Did that emergency clearing kick well into the Irish half from his 10 metre line!

 

[Brumby Runner]

I'd also add Gnostic that there has been a cultural war on kicking in Australian rugby for a generation at all levels of the game to the extent that the art of tactical kicking has almost disappeared. The only form of tactical kicking deemed acceptable to many of those who follow the game is the cross kick for the winger to score. Long kicks for territory are deemed unAustralian. This was reinforced to me a couple of years ago when I watched Joeys play Newington in a game played in heavy rain and a howling gale. Joeys ran with the wind in the first half and didn't kick the ball once and tried to run the ball out of their own half unsuccessfully - they were behind at half time and subsequently lost the game.

As I've repeatedly observed, the whole running rugby obsession is based on the myth that Randwick (in particular) never kicked the ball. Guys like Mark Ella, David Knox and David Campese had brilliant tactical kicking games - yes their first option was to run, but if it wasn't the option they booted the ball long for touch and made 50 easy metres. Ella and Knox were also masters at potting field goals when nothing else was on.

I like long, territory gaining kicks, and even better if they are followed up by a strong defensive line to contain the opposition in their own half. I hate a kick for touch from our 20m line that wins about 15m if lucky (considering the kicker is usually another 10m behind the gain line) and simply turns over possession at the lineout in a favourable attacking position for the opposition. By way of illustration, just look to the ABs when they kick from their 20m line. Invariably it goes long and stays in play. The straight line defense following the kick keeps the opposition under pressure until a turnover mostly occurs at a ruck, or through a knock on.

Conversely, how many times do the ABs take a quick throw in when the opposition kicks for touch. Mostly, I'd say. They don't seem to rely on set piece lineouts unless they simply can't be avoided. And I have concluded from watching them that more line breaks are made and more tries are scored these days from unstructured play following quick lineouts than from set piece play. Probably the most successful set piece play today is the rolling maul, but they don't account for the larger part of the try scoring from the ABs. The game is a-changin".

 

[dru]

You know who showed that he can kick on Saturday? Samu fucking Kerevi. Did that emergency clearing kick well into the Irish half from his 10 metre line!

I'd forgotten about that! From recollection though I not sure whose face more stunned by the result - his or mine. ;-)

 

[KevinO]

Finally having a chance to go through the stats for all 3 games.

Possession: Aus 44.3% Ire 55.66%
Lineouts: Aus 34/38 Ire 30/33
Scrums: Aus 13/13 Ire 11/14
Penalties: Aus 40 Ire 35
Tackles: Aus 409/478 Ire 352/403
Meters Run: Aus 893 Ire 1079
Runs: Aus 343 Ire 430
Kicks From Hand: Aus 53 Ire 42
Passes: Aus 479 Ire 522
Clean Breaks: Aus 12 Ire 22
Defenders Beaten: Aus 51 Ire 69
Offloads: Aus 15 Ire 17
Turnovers conceded: Aus 27 Ire 38

All pretty even, if anything the stats from game two should have had Ireland winning that one by alot more

 

[Brumby Runner]

I'd forgotten about that! From recollection though I not sure whose face more stunned by the result - his or mine. ;-)

Nah, he knew precisely what he was doing. He had demonstrated a long kicking skill in previous games this year but hardly any fans apparently took notice. He is still developing his overall game but has now added a kicking skill that shows a lot of promise. He is second to none in the Wallabies side for off loading in traffic, and we all know he can make a line break or just get over the gain line consistently. Not a lot left before he can, and should, fill the No 12 spot with ease.

 

[Derpus]

Nah, he knew precisely what he was doing. He had demonstrated a long kicking skill in previous games this year but hardly any fans apparently took notice. He is still developing his overall game but has now added a kicking skill that shows a lot of promise. He is second to none in the Wallabies side for off loading in traffic, and we all know he can make a line break or just get over the gain line consistently. Not a lot left before he can, and should, fill the No 12 spot with ease.

Shame he didn't do it once.

 

[barbarian]

The last play of the game was just amazing.

We score that try and it's an all-time great performance. As it was, it's a crushing defeat. Perfect Foley kick-off, great Folau take, good movement from side to side, hard hits and accurate cleanouts.

We created the space and had the numbers........ but fucked it. Beale crabbed a bit too far, Foley did too, the outside men (Samu and DHP) were a little bit too flat, Stockdale made a great defensive decision to come in.

There were just inches in it, really, and it's the line between ecstasy and agony.

Fuck it. What a game.
.

 

[Braveheart81]

I reckon in general our wingers were playing too flat. They weren't flat enough to ever receive a cut out pass without needing to stop.

Need to adjust their depth and be flatter as the ball is with the player closer to them.

A couple of those passes to DHP could have really led to something if he'd been able to hit that ball without slowing.

Passes weren't nearly perfect but his positioning also didn't allow a perfect pass without throwing it forward.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Tapatalk

 

[Up the Guts]

The last play of the game was just amazing.

We score that try and it's an all-time great performance. As it was, it's a crushing defeat. Perfect Foley kick-off, great Folau take, good movement from side to side, hard hits and accurate cleanouts.

We created the space and had the numbers.... but fucked it. Beale crabbed a bit too far, Foley did too, the outside men (Samu and DHP) were a little bit too flat, Stockdale made a great defensive decision to come in.

There were just inches in it, really, and it's the line between ecstasy and agony.

Fuck it. What a game.
.

Last 2 minutes felt like Bledislode II last year in reverse, just don't quite have the skill execution under pressure of NZ.

 

[swingpass]

The last play of the game was just amazing.

We score that try and it's an all-time great performance. As it was, it's a crushing defeat. Perfect Foley kick-off, great Folau take, good movement from side to side, hard hits and accurate cleanouts.

We created the space and had the numbers.... but fucked it. Beale crabbed a bit too far, Foley did too, the outside men (Samu and DHP) were a little bit too flat, Stockdale made a great defensive decision to come in.
.

And no one changed the angle. if Kerevi had come inside when Foley was crabbing Stockdale would have checked then Foley would passed to a two on one situation or given the switch pass to Kerevi.

 

[Istanbul]

How many of these players are actually based in Samoa and Tonga? I would bet that they are overwhelmingly based in Australia, where there are literally scores, maybe hundreds, of paid jobs in league for every one in our game. How many of them grew up in Australia or New Zealand?


What is World Rugby supposed to do?

Sit back and watch league take over I'd say.