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Western Force 2012

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Grandmaster Flash

Johnnie Wallace (23)
What we are missing, as others have alluded to, is a distributor/stepper at 12 and a playmaker at 10. I'm not sure young Ben Seymour is the answer to either question at the moment, but he's giving 100% out there and I can't fault that. I wouldn't mind see Dave Harvey come up into first receiver a bit more, as 10 is his natural position.

Didn't watch the game but was gonna ask if Harvey was a 10 playing 15. Could be a good move to give him a shot there when (if) Shepherd comes back.
 

Lee Grant

John Eales (66)
Staff member
Wykes has been great at the Force and I can't believe there is any criticism of the way he's played.

Nobody can criticise Wykes too much: he plays close to his ability every week. If there is any whinge about him it should be about the type of player he is, but it's not really his fault.

He is one of those notters. Some notters are not really specialist 6s, 7s or 8s, but can play 2, or maybe all 3, positions. Other notters are not specialist 2nd rowers at the Super level, and not really 6s either.

This 2nd group of notters are usually lanky: tall enough or at least with a high enough reach at lineout time, but don't have the build to impose themselves physically. If they play in the 2nd row they usually scrummage on the left hand side of the scrum. They can survive in the professional environment if they have the skill of a backrower around the park, have a bit of toe and are even faster between the ears.

Now and then you get a Wykes type who has a hard edge to his play. Sam doesn't have that; so it's one criticism, I suppose. Young Luke Jones at the Rebels could have it but we will have to see him play against better teams than the Blues to confirm it.


Edit: have just seen Waylon's remarks. There's a bit of truth in what he says about Wykes. Even if he has evolved as a skills type player due to his build, he has to be at the coal face more than he is.

Sharpie is scarcely a Brad Thorn either; so when the two of them are locking there is some grunt missing. Lynn is closer to the hard-working tough guy type needed but the Force have to find a premium tight head lock to take over Sharpe's contract, since Battye is not going to be a grunter.

Even if it takes a couple of years they should try to find someone like that - and look for an elite LHP while they are at it.
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Moono75

Guest
Friday night against the Tahs is crunch time. Need this win to link up with 4 points for the bye to close the gap on the leaders. Interested to see what RG does with Nalaga and Shepherd available. Whatever he does, he needs to make sure Mafi gets plenty of touches as he along with Cummins have looked the most dangerous players for the Force. Nalaga needs to come in and get involved from the start. Ball distribution will be key, far too many passes shuffled to players standing flat footed against the chiefs.
 

Lee Grant

John Eales (66)
Staff member
One hopes that Cummins is always played at 13 by the Force from now on. I think he is Wallaby material in that position: maybe not the main guy, but the back up man, who can obviously play on the wing also. If Cross played for Oz, so could Cummins.

Mafi is showing very good signs too. Let's keep watching him.

I gave Seymour faint praise when he got a full contract and said he had to learn his trade on the job, but he has done better than I thought, especially when Stannard went off against the Reds, IIRR. He played better for the Force than I have seen him play for Manly at a lower level of rugby. Well done that man.

I don't think he will be the main guy for the Force at 10 for a couple of years but starting on a regular basis in a time of adversity will show us what he is made of - and him also.
 
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Moono75

Guest
I think your right, Cummins has shown his best form in the centres as he did in 2011 when filling in due to injuries. Wasted on the wing as the ball wasn't getting out to him anyway....or at least with any space to do anything. He's only 25 so hopefully he gets the nod for the Wallabies squad. Need to find someone to pair him with as I haven't been impressed by Stanley. Sidey and Cummins could probably benefit by adding a couple of extras KG's to their frames.

Seymour needs to get a few more games under his belt to see how he develops. It's a lot easier to play well when your winning and the pressure isn't on so much. Sheehan needs to make sure he gets him quick ball. I guess we will see Friday which Force team shows up. Tahs will be up for a bit of payback for sure and I'm sure Palu will be a wrecking ball.
 

todd4

Jim Clark (26)
The next step in Cummins development as a 13 will be when he starts looking for an off-load after making a break. At the moment the ball dies with him and its becoming too predictable.
 
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Moono75

Guest
The next step in Cummins development as a 13 will be when he starts looking for an off-load after making a break. At the moment the ball dies with him and its becoming too predictable.
yes..as mentioned before there were two times in the Chiefs game where he had players outside him in potential try scoring positions and he held it.
 

The_Brown_Hornet

John Eales (66)
He'll learn all of that if Woody keeps him at 13 though. His move to outside centre has been one of the real successes for the Force in the last couple of years.
 
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Moono75

Guest
Cummins real advantage is that he can take the ball into contact and make it over the advantage line. Something that has been lacking in the other players tried so far this season.
 

thierry dusautoir

Alan Cameron (40)
Cummins is for the force what Anthony Fainga'a is to reds. A midfiled man who you can rely to truck it over tha advantage lien when the backline gets in trouble (which is alot for the force). I feel if the force had more than just cummins and mafi as options those two would flourish. I would liek to see a force backlien like this over the next few weeks.

9.Sheehan
10.Harvey
11. Nalaga
12. Stanley
13.Cummins
14.Mafi
15. Shepherd
 
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Moono75

Guest
Cummins is for the force what Anthony Fainga'a is to reds. A midfiled man who you can rely to truck it over tha advantage lien when the backline gets in trouble (which is alot for the force). I feel if the force had more than just cummins and mafi as options those two would flourish. I would liek to see a force backlien like this over the next few weeks.

9.Sheehan
10.Harvey
11. Nalaga
12. Stanley
13.Cummins
14.Mafi
15. Shepherd
Yeah I would like to see Harvey given a run at 10. Not sure about Stanley though. For sure Cummins and Mafi would benefit from having some additional attacking threats in the backline to free them up. Shepherd unfortunatley is a week to week proposition at this stage.
 
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Gollum

Guest
One hopes that Cummins is always played at 13 by the Force from now on. I think he is Wallaby material in that position: maybe not the main guy, but the back up man, who can obviously play on the wing also. If Cross played for Oz, so could Cummins.

Mafi is showing very good signs too. Let's keep watching him.

I have to admit I have never really rated cummins but after seeing a few of his performances this year he definitely has potential. He constantly gets over the advantage line, appears to be defensively sound from what I've seen, and at 13 he gets his hands on the ball much more often. I don't think the force lose anything by moving him in from the wing either, Mafi, Nalaga and Wara are all more than capable out wide. The force have nothing to lose and everything to gain by keeping him at 13.

Does anyone know when Cummins and Mafi are contracted until?
 

GaffaCHinO

Peter Sullivan (51)
I have to admit I have never really rated cummins but after seeing a few of his performances this year he definitely has potential. He constantly gets over the advantage line, appears to be defensively sound from what I've seen, and at 13 he gets his hands on the ball much more often. I don't think the force lose anything by moving him in from the wing either, Mafi, Nalaga and Wara are all more than capable out wide. The force have nothing to lose and everything to gain by keeping him at 13.

Does anyone know when Cummins and Mafi are contracted until?
Mafi Till end of 2012 and Cummings till end of 2013.
 

thierry dusautoir

Alan Cameron (40)
Malfie at 12 you think? I dont know.....I its a waste of his speed having him there and i am not sure if his defence would hold against the likes of Nonu or McCabe
 

Lee Grant

John Eales (66)
Staff member
Mafi played 13 some in his younger days and was not the worst.

As for Cummins having to use the ball more: that is right. It can be acceptable in a 12 to truck the ball up a lot because he is usually at the tackle line when he gets the ball, but the 13 has to be able to give the golden ball to wingers and fullbacks on the outside or inside.

This is a skill that Mortlock never had and it never stopped him from being useful; but it looks a lot better to national selectors if there is more than one string to the bow.
 
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Moono75

Guest
What about Tupou? He got a run in one game earlier on but maybe wasn't ready. I don't recall him being terrible. Has good size. Not sure if he has an injury at the moment.
 

Shiggins

Steve Williams (59)
Some really good talk here. Loving it.

Cummins has continued on from last year, great form.
You guys are defiantly right about the offloads though. atm he doesn't even think about it and your right, it is predictable. if he got a few offloads away on friday night we could see some good LB's up the middle.
 
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