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2012 Rugby Championship Round 3 Game 1 Australia vs South Africa - 8 Sep

Who will win 2012 Rugby Championship Round 3 Game 1 between SAF and AUS?

  • The Men In Gold – Australia

    Votes: 52 64.2%
  • The Bokke – South Africa

    Votes: 29 35.8%

  • Total voters
    81
  • Poll closed .
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FrankLind

Colin Windon (37)
Wasn't sure where to post this. These are the thoughts of the former AB, and current Chiefs backline coach Wayne Smith.

David Long wrote in one of New Zealand’s Sunday papers that “the Wallabies’ next game is against the Wallabies…” It was a typo, but never has a truer word been written. At the moment Australia are beating themselves before they have even run onto the pitch.
Yes, Australia are missing a number of key players at the moment, but they are also missing something far more important. For all the Aussie swagger and larrikin, the current group of players is lacking belief. They are playing like a side that is down on itself. After all the golden years it has not been a good few months for the Aussies across most sports and the rugby team is playing like a side on a downer.
Attack is more than an attitude – it’s a mood, and the mood that informs the best attacks is OPTIMISM. The Wallabies have been bullish off the field leading into this Rugby Championship. Many of their players have spoken at length at becoming the number one ranked team in the world. This optimism hasn’t been backed up on the field. They lack positivity and confidence in attack. Their biggest tests now are against themselves
The biggest contrast between the All Blacks and Wallabies is not attitude or character. The Aussies put their bodies on the line for their country at the weekend. They hit New Zealand hard throughout the match. The biggest difference is belief in their attack and a clear strategy to implement it.
The offloads statistic from this game tells a story. 25-2 to the All Blacks. It is a story of belief, trust and optimism, and the ending was a happy one for New Zealanders. Time and again, the All Blacks sent runners in to the fray only for them to pass and create a point of contact elsewhere.
Ball carriers consequently won collisions which enabled them to keep the ball alive by offloading to support players who noticeably worked harder to get behind the ball this week. It also meant they got super fast ball if the offload wasn’t on. In contrast, the Wallabies’ forwards tried to smash through All Black defenders who were waiting for them and consequently lost the collisions, failed to keep the ball alive and had to play off slow ball.
The other area where there is a marked difference in attitude is counter attack. Ball received from opposition kicks is a massively important possession source in today’s game. The All Blacks see this as an opportunity, the Wallabies see it as a threat.
Getting caught in their own territory when running a kick back seems to be anathema to Australia. They prefer to boot it back and hope that the opposition make a mistake. Bob Dwyer once described that as a miserable way to play rugby. I wonder what he thinks of the current Wallaby playing style.
I also wonder what Bob thinks about the discipline of some of the younger players. There is huge accountability and responsibility among this group of young All Blacks. Australia set that tone in in the nineties,winning two World Cups. This current group needs to find that formula again.
Young All Blacks are starting to establish their own legacy in the jersey. The All Blacks performances in the first two matches haven’t been complete, but they threatened to be. There is pride and a sense of history coursing through the veins of this team. New Zealand will take some stopping.
 

FrankLind

Colin Windon (37)
And on SA

The greatest challenge to both South Africa and Argentina in their opening match of the Rugby Championship is to play without fear. Recent evidence suggests that such a leap may be beyond them. Both teams are utterly fearless in defence, but in possession they tend to travel down too many safe roads. They don’t crash and they don’t get very far.
South Africa have become way too predictable. Against England their pass to kick ratio was 3:1. When a team knows a kick is coming it is very easy to set the backfield and establish counter attacking opportunities.
Moreover the standard of South Africa’s kicking has deteriorated. It is a while since Morne Steyn has been at his best. And as he has struggled with his game, Steyn has dropped deeper and deeper, making it hard for his outside backs to function.
A big part of Steyn’s loss of form has to do with the absence of Fourie du Preez. The South African was the best kicking half back in the world. He would even drop off the number eight and kick-pass cross field to the wing. That threat opened up the space for Steyn to kick into.
But Derick Hougaard is nothing like as good a kicker as du Preez. He leans back on his box kicks and tends to sky them. The Bulls and South Africa have even developed an elongated ruck to try to give him more time.
But I have some sympathy for Hougaard. He is a running 9 and it is hard to attack from half back when the outside backs are coming forwards. The answer is to get Steyn to stand flatter. I had a similar conundrum with Paul Grayson at Northampton. But he is such a good ball player, that when I challenged Grayson to stand flatter, he did so to remarkable effect. Heyneke Meyer faces the same challenge.
Steyn has the courage and the coordination to run straight and use his hands. I would love to see Francois Steyn, jean de Villiers and the South African wings brought more into the game. The wings have great ability but they are chasing wings at the moment. Loyalty is a great part of South Africa’s current strength, but their wings must be getting tired of just playing a chasing game.
I would love to see Argentina open up a bit more and it will be fascinating to see whether Graham Henry has had any influence on that part of the game. They have a number of exciting runners developed through their sevens programme, but I wonder whether they will have the courage to use them.
Lucas Gonzalez Amorosino, Gonzalez Camacho and Horacio Agulla form a vibrant back three if they are given the license. But how will Jaun Martin Hernandez perform on his return to big time international rugby. He was a great footballer but we haven’t seen a lot of him in recent years.
Argentina were hugely competitive in the first half of our World Cup quarter final. They have one of the best defences in world rugby. But defence can only take you so far. I hope that Hernandez is given the same license to play that Dan Carter enjoys with the All Blacks. But I suspect a safety first approach is more likely.
The Boks and the Pumas are likely to grind teams down. That won’t be enough to win the Championship. Maybe they will prove me wrong. I hope so, because both teams have the players to do so much more.
 

p.Tah

John Thornett (49)
A Rugby Championship match in Perth on September 8 could cause major headaches to the AFL's finals fixturing, with league boss Andrew Demetriou conceding the issue could have a flow-on effect.
Perth's Patersons Stadium will be unavailable for AFL use on Saturday week due to the hosting of the Wallabies versus Springboks game.
A worst-case scenario for the AFL would be if both West Coast and Fremantle earned the right to a home elimination final next week.
If that eventuated, the AFL would have no other choice but to schedule one elimination final on the Friday night and the other elimination final on the Sunday, with the two qualifying finals to be played on the Saturday...
Demetriou said the AFL would have little choice but to deal with whatever outcome arose.
"It has an impact on the rest of the finals from the perspective of things like six-day breaks and seven-day breaks and travelling," Demetriou said in Perth on Monday.
"It's not ideal.
"We've spoken to the government and to the football commission today about trying to avoid that in the future, but it is what it is and we'll deal with it."

http://news.brisbanetimes.com.au/br...l-finals-fixture-headache-20120827-24wf4.html

In other words, the government better talk to us before they give any other code the green light to use an AFL stadium in the future.
 

Groucho

Greg Davis (50)
Your point? Phil Kearns opinions have zero relevance. He is coated in fake tan and full of hot air.

The point of "looks like Tarzan, plays like Jane" is as subtle as a sledgehammer. Even as a Rebels fan, I really can't warm to Inman's game. He plays 10kg below his weight, like Lloyd Johannsen.
 

Jets

Paul McLean (56)
Staff member
I was actually impressed with him, but then again I didn't watch all of the Rebels games. I look back to Nonu when he started for the AB's and he had a lot of weaknesses in his game but they saw the potential and he has repaid the faith shown in him. I just think Inman is the only 13 left in the country. Horne has had plenty of opportunity but seems to be regressing. He needs to have a good Super season to find his mojo again. I really hope the Tah's get a coach who allows the backline to play with some enterprise and vigour as it will change the approach of the players in the Gold jersey for next year.
 

Joe Blow

Peter Sullivan (51)
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) should be put at 13 and given time to really own that position. Horne has had more than enough time but seems unable to turn half chances into breaks.
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) was playing amazing rugby at 13 a couple of years ago with Cooper and Beale confident and on fire. Those two need a strong tackle breaking 13 to work with.
There are other options at fullback and on the wing.
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is the only player who consistently catches the high ball.

I think keeping him at fullback (particularly with Beale so out of form/fitness) is the best option.

Horne has barely had any opportunity with ball in hand against the All Blacks. Every time it has made it out that far it is just a player transferring pressure. He gets the ball with nowhere to go.

I don't think anyone would have provided any attacking flair at 13 with the tactics/play we have been exhibiting. There just haven't been any opportunities.
 

Brisbok

Cyril Towers (30)
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) should be put at 13 and given time to really own that position. Horne has had more than enough time but seems unable to turn half chances into breaks.
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) was playing amazing rugby at 13 a couple of years ago with Cooper and Beale confident and on fire. Those two need a strong tackle breaking 13 to work with.
There are other options at fullback and on the wing.
Agreed. I cannot understand why AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is not given time to specialise at one position both at Wallabies and Super Rugby level! He has been one of the most consistent performers in the backs for the last few seasons, yet he is constantly shifted from 13, to wing, to fullback, filling in gaps for whoever is injured or out of form. IMO he is too good a player to be wasted in this manner. He is good enough to be specialising at either 13 or 15, but with Beale at 15 and the Wallabies' problems in the centres, why not give him a solid run at 13?
 

Brisbok

Cyril Towers (30)
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is the only player who consistently catches the high ball.

I think keeping him at fullback (particularly with Beale so out of form/fitness) is the best option.

Until Beale regains his form at 15, then shift AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) out to 14, then Horne will get injured and back to 13 and the cycle continues?
 

Richo

John Thornett (49)
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) plays consistently well but rarely brilliantly. This means he copes well with the chopping and changing but doesn't play games that simply demand he hold onto a particular jersey. It's the curse of utility.
 

Brisbok

Cyril Towers (30)
AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) plays consistently well but rarely brilliantly. This means he copes well with the chopping and changing but doesn't play games that simply demand he hold onto a particular jersey. It's the curse of utility.

Is that possibly because he is never given a decent run at one particular position?
 
T

TOCC

Guest
I dont like the swapping and changing of AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) either... Can't help but feel he would be one of the best 13's in the world if he were actually given some consistent time in the position
 

Richo

John Thornett (49)
Is that possibly because he is never given a decent run at one particular position?

Probably. I don't agree with the shuffling either, but I think there's a reason for it other than crap coaching... The problem of being reliably good at many things, but not necessarily (i.e. not yet proven to be) absolutely brilliant at one thing.

I think he could be great at 13, too. He played well there (but, I would say, not amazingly) when he had a solid run a couple of years ago.
 

Brisbok

Cyril Towers (30)
Probably. I don't agree with the shuffling either, but I think there's a reason for it other than crap coaching. The problem of being reliably good at many things, but not necessarily (i.e. not yet proven to be) absolutely brilliant at one thing.

I think he could be great at 13, too. He played well there (but, I would say, not amazingly) when he had a solid run a couple of years ago.

Yes agreed. However if the yardstick for measuring someone is whether or not they played amazingly or brilliantly, how does Horne ever get a run?
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
With Beale out of form, I think AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) is the best option at fullback.

I wouldn't be against moving him to 13, but we'd have to bite the bullet and say that Beale is staying at 15 whilst he gets back to full form/fitness.

I don't think we have any other good options at fullback. If we weren't playing Beale or AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) at fullback I think Barnes would be my next choice. I don't want to see JOC (James O'Connor) there.
 

Brisbok

Cyril Towers (30)
Out of interest, once JOC (James O'Connor) is fit again, where do you see him fitting into the current set up? Perhaps the question can be broken down into two parts:

1 - Where would you like to see him?
2 - Where do you think Dingo will play him?
 

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
1. On the wing.
2. On the wing.

I don't want to see him at 10 and I don't think we can play 10. Cooper and 12. JOC (James O'Connor).
 
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