2012 S15 All things Referee thread

[PaarlBok]

Week 3
Crusaders vs Chiefs in Napier
Referee: Garratt Williamson (New Zealand)
Assistant referees: Mike Fraser (New Zealand), Nick Briant (New Zealand)
Television match official: Richard Kelly (New Zealand)
Force vs Hurricanes in Perth
Referee: Jaco Peyper (South Africa)
Assistant referees: Andrew Lees (Australia), Ed Martin (Australia)
Television match official: Matt Goddard (Australia)
Brumbies vs Cheetahs in Canberra
Referee: Keith Brown (New Zealand)
Assistant referees: Simon Moore (Australia), Julian Pritchard (Australia)
Television match official: George Ayoub (Australia)
Highlanders vs Waratahs in Dunedin
Referee: Bryce Lawrence (New Zealand)
Assistant referees: Vinny Munro (New Zealand), Garratt Williamson (New Zealand)
Television match official: Kane McBride (New Zealand)
Reds vs Rebels in Brisbane
Referee: Angus Gardner (Australia)
Assistant referees: Damien Mitchelmore (Australia), Rohan Hoffman (Australia)
Television match official: Steve Lesczcynski (Australia)
Sharks vs Lions in Durban
Referee: Mark Lawrence (South Africa)
Assistant referees: Quinton Immelman (South Africa), Marc van Zyl (South Africa)
Television match official: Johann Meuwesen (South Africa)
Bulls vs Blues in Pretoria
Referee: Steve Walsh (Australia)
Assistant referees: Pro Legoete (South Africa), Stefan Breytenbach (South Africa)
Television match official: Gerrie Coetzee (South Africa)

 

[Hawko]

All we can hope for now is that Bryce does a hamstring in the warm-up and Vinny gets a gig. I don't think that Munro has had a referee's job this year - looks like they are sidelining him to allow for some "new" talent. Waste of a very good referee.

 

[Lindommer]

The referee is the sole judge of time, kind of says it all.

Not necessarily, the ref can appoint an official timekeeper. Came in about 2003.

 

[sonny crockett]

Yes correct, agree with that, point I was making was that the clock on the scoreboard unless part of the official timing, wheterh by ref or appointee, is not overly relevant to the state of time in the game.

 

[yourmatesam]

All we can hope for now is that Bryce does a hamstring in the warm-up and Vinny gets a gig. I don't think that Munro has had a referee's job this year - looks like they are sidelining him to allow for some "new" talent. Waste of a very good referee.

I agree Hawko, I like the way Vinny referees. It's a shame he doesn't get more game time.

 

[Toby Lerone]

All we can hope for now is that Bryce does a hamstring in the warm-up and Vinny gets a gig. I don't think that Munro has had a referee's job this year - looks like they are sidelining him to allow for some "new" talent. Waste of a very good referee.

It was announced around the time of the RWC that Vinny Munro was losing his contract as a full time referee in New Zealand, a shame really. He was also dropped from the Super Rugby panel altogether, so we'll not see him take charge of any matches (unless there's an injury and he's AR1). There are 7 NZ referees selected (B Lawrence, Pollock, Brown, Williamson, White, Jackson and Fraser) but it's a pity that the NZRU see officials like Bryce and Keith Brown as better options than him.

 

[suckerforred]

I know it was Gargner's first Super Rugby game, but has anyone else got an opinion of him?

 

[barbarian]

He's pretty good from what I've seen of him. Young, will hopefully get better with experience. Thought he did pretty well last night, let the game flow nicely.

 

[suckerforred]

Maybe I need to watch it again without my redtinted glasses............

 

[Inside Shoulder]

I know it was Gargner's first Super Rugby game, but has anyone else got an opinion of him?

Well he blew my mind with his first "advantage over"call: i have grave misgivings about the way the advantage law is reffed at the moment. i gather that the view is taken that if it corss the gain line then an advantage has accrued - that isnt fair and can be downright penal.
His first call the kick was charged down - I think. Bad start but otherwise seemed OK.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

Maybe I need to watch it again without my redtinted glasses............

yes - well it was a rebels kick that was charged down

 

[yourmatesam]

B Lawrence

Vinny shits on Bryce.

 

[Hawko]

Well, it didn't take long for the judicial process to fall flat on its face. At around 51 minutes Kade Poki executed a tip tackle on Adam Ashley-Cooper right in front of the AR. According to the guidelines it was a straight red card. There was no report to the referee although the NZ commentators managed to pick it up quite clearly. Seems the citing commissioner was blind too as there appears to have been no referral to the panel (I checked the Sanzar site).

Question: When is a tip tackle not a tip tackle? Answer: When its done by a NZ player in front of NZ officials with a NZ citing commissioner.

 

[Bruwheresmycar]

I reckon it could be a penalty for dangerous tackling. Not sure if it's counts as a spear tackle though (which is an automatic red card). A spear tackle occurs when a player is lifted past the horizontal and then speared to the ground, or dropped from a height with no regard for player safety.

AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) was dropped on his side from a pretty low height. Not driven to the ground or dropped on his head.

These are always technical, that's my take on it anyway. Some people will say too harsh and some not harsh enough.

 

[Inside Shoulder]

But in recent times if you lifted a player and his head was below his bum you were in trouble whether you speared him or not. The rationale being to discourage lifting tackles because the laws of physics dictate that unexpected shit happens.


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[Slim 293]

I reckon it could be a penalty for dangerous tackling. Not sure if it's counts as a spear tackle though (which is an automatic red card). A spear tackle occurs when a player is lifted past the horizontal and then speared to the ground, or dropped from a height with no regard for player safety.

AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper) was dropped on his side from a pretty low height. Not driven to the ground or dropped on his head.

These are always technical, that's my take on it anyway. Some people will say too harsh and some not harsh enough.

Yeah, there was no way that warranted a card at all...

 

[Hawko]

Yeah, there was no way that warranted a card at all...

Have another look at the tape and then see the guidelines. Maybe the guidelines are too harsh, but they are what referees are supposed to rule on.

 

[Slim 293]

After reviewing the guidelines it appears that Bryce reffed the situation 100% correctly... according to the IRB in regards to lifting tackles:

- The player is lifted and then forced or ‘speared’ into the ground (red card offence)

- The lifted player is dropped to the ground from a height with no regard to the player’s safety (red card offence)

- For all other types of dangerous lifting tackles a yellow card or penalty may be considered sufficient

 

[fatprop]

After reviewing the guidelines it appears that Bryce reffed the situation 100% correctly... according to the IRB in regards to lifting tackles:

It was the perfect thing to go on report.

Was it a lifting tackle? Maybe/dunno

Stick up the white card, let the boffins look at it on Monday and move on with the game.

 

[suckerforred]

After reviewing the guidelines it appears that Bryce reffed the situation 100% correctly... according to the IRB in regards to lifting tackles:

Not sure about that. It was a lifting tackle. Should have at least been a penality. These was none. Should have been a white card, there was none. Should have been a warning, there was none. Recent history has been such that any lifting of a player was to receive the severest penality. Just ask Sam Warbuton.