Ireland vs Springbokke @ Aviva

[Antony]

Too much jacking it over the Gray brothers in the Scotland game. Otherwise it was nice.

Any more of them in the production line?

 

[Highlander35]

No, same question was asked in the Post match interview. Grant Gilchrist is a good player though, will probably take Johnnies spot in the starting XV when fit.

Toolis twins could be anything though. That could be pair 42 of the brothers.

 

[PaarlBok]

Congrats to the Iere, they were by far the better team. I have no idea what Meyer will do, clearly no plan B. Bokke have massive problems a year out from WC. Massive.

 

[Braveheart81]

I wouldn't be too worried PB. I think the Springboks have looked good this year.

There was definitely a case of underestimating Ireland. Could have been a different game if SA had taken all their shots at goal in the first half.

It reminded me of when Australia lost to Scotland in Newcastle a couple of years ago. We decided that it was a game we were going to win so we'd kick for the corner before we'd actually done anything to set up the win.

 

[Dewald Nel]

Underestimating them was definitely the cause.

Going for a lineout 3 times - THREE! - in the first half, when it was clearly kickable. Also Pollard taking on a clearly big wall of defenders was probably not the best idea. They clearly saw him play earlier this year, and made sure his channel was closed. Ironically, this was the type of test where a guy like Lambie or Steyn would have been a better fit. Against England, Pollard must also play a bit more territorially than he did this weekend. Otherwise he just gets shut down and turn over, like it happened this weekend.

Also, Hougie didn't seem focused. At one stage, I counted 4 passes in a row that either hit the ground, or went behind the player. Could have been more actually.

So, I'll put that one down to complacency.

Positives is the old guys seemed industrious - Matfield made plenty of tackles and cleans, and Jean took the ball up many times. Anyone blaming the old guys for this one, must take the soap out of their eyes.

Those with good memories, like me, will remember actually picking young guys too soon in front of experienced, good players also being able to backfire - ask Nick Mallett (1998).

Good thing is we play England this weekend, so we'll see pretty quickly whether it was complacency.

 

[PaarlBok]

I wouldn't be too worried PB. I think the Springboks have looked good this year.

There was definitely a case of underestimating Ireland. Could have been a different game if SA had taken all their shots at goal in the first half.

It reminded me of when Australia lost to Scotland in Newcastle a couple of years ago. We decided that it was a game we were going to win so we'd kick for the corner before we'd actually done anything to set up the win.

I'll be surprise if we beat the English. They looked really good vs the All Blacks.

JdV did the same kak with the Stormers, a captain as experienced as he should know you need to built a innings in test rugby, like the Irish did.

 

[Braveheart81]

Also, Hougie didn't seem focused. At one stage, I counted 4 passes in a row that either hit the ground, or went behind the player. Could have been more actually.

So, I'll put that one down to complacency.

He had a poor game. There were a couple of times when he knocked on or let the ball go past him at the back of the breakdown because he was starting to focus on what he was going to do next.

Reinach should start next weekend.

I'll be surprise if we beat the English. They looked really good vs the All Blacks.

Yeah, but that's probably how it should be playing them away from home. England are genuinely a top 4 side at the moment and they should probably start narrow favourites against South Africa at home.

Will take an excellent performance from SA or Australia to beat England on this tour. Only New Zealand can do it without playing close to their best.

 

[JSRF10]

Underestimating them was definitely the cause.

Don't think your giving Ireland enough credit there. The Boks weren't beaten by some passionate manic effort, they were absolutely hammered by a clinical disciplined outfit. Joe Schmidt prepared his side perfectly and got his tactics and selection spot on, and gave the Boks the kind of shellacking that only BNZ have come close to in recent times.

There seems to be a lot of people in the Southern Hemisphere underestimating this Ireland side but with our coach, captain and half backs I think we're really good value for a long run the World Cup and worth a sneaky punt at 12/1.

Also, Hougie didn't seem focused. At one stage, I counted 4 passes in a row that either hit the ground, or went behind the player. Could have been more actually.

I know Ruan Piennar isn't rated by a lot of Saffers but I reckon he'd have made a difference in this game. He would have taken a lot of pressure off Pollard whose tactical kicking game was poor.

 

[Ruggo]

Congrats to the Iere, they were by far the better team. I have no idea what Meyer will do, clearly no plan B. Bokke have massive problems a year out from WC. Massive.

Not sure Paarl. I don't think it looks as bad as you are making it out. It looked like they took the Irish lightly and payed the price. This kick up the arse is just the tonic.

I hope Meyer don't shit the bed and bring in a heap of chicken runners. You got good talent in SA without them.

 

[PaarlBok]

I know Ruan Piennar isn't rated by a lot of Saffers but I reckon he'd have made a difference in this game. He would have taken a lot of pressure off Pollard whose tactical kicking game was poor.

Please not Pienaar. He played now nearly a 100 tests without claiming the 9 jersey. Hope he pick Reinach and give Lambie a run in 10. Both deserve their change. HM should just concentrate, take a few knocks now and look one year ahead. We need changes in our playing personel now, not 1 year from now.

 

[PaarlBok]

Not sure Paarl. I don't think it looks as bad as you are making it out. It looked like they took the Irish lightly and payed the price. This kick up the arse is just the tonic.

I hope Meyer don't shit the bed and bring in a heap of chicken runners. You got good talent in SA without them.

This is exactly what he'll do. He'll pick Vermaak above Reinach, here. first.

 

[PaarlBok]

Don't think your giving Ireland enough credit there. The Boks weren't beaten by some passionate manic effort, they were absolutely hammered by a clinical disciplined outfit. Joe Schmidt prepared his side perfectly and got his tactics and selection spot on, and gave the Boks the kind of shellacking that only BNZ have come close to in recent times.

There seems to be a lot of people in the Southern Hemisphere underestimating this Ireland side but with our coach, captain and half backs I think we're really good value for a long run the World Cup and worth a sneaky punt at 12/1.

Thats exactly what I saw on saturday. The young Irish young guns showed reaal hunger and passion. You get this when you select young players. Our run on side know they are already in the WC sqaud and played like they were on holiday.

 

[Blue]

This is exactly what he'll do. He'll pick Vermaak above Reinach, here. first.

Problem is Reinach is too similar to Hougaard and Reinach's kicking is as poor.

Wtf do we do?

God how we miss du Preez.

This test summed up why the Boks will never be as dominant as the All Blacks. We just don't have that same intense focus and smarts.

This game was an embarrassment for Meyer, JdV and Matfield. Piss poor. It needed smarts. We were like morons. Same shit from minute 41 as the first 40. It was like watching a train wreck in 80 minute slow motion.

Vokken dom.

 

[Blue]

Not sure Paarl. I don't think it looks as bad as you are making it out. It looked like they took the Irish lightly and payed the price. This kick up the arse is just the tonic.

I hope Meyer don't shit the bed and bring in a heap of chicken runners. You got good talent in SA without them.

That's my point.

Why do we need tonic?

We should just have the bloody tonic.

Like the All Blacks. They don't need losing to get them up for games. They just get up.

 

[PaarlBok]

Problem is Reinach is too similar to Hougaard and Reinach's kicking is as poor.

Wtf do we do?

God how we miss du Preez.

This test summed up why the Boks will never be as dominant as the All Blacks. We just don't have that same intense focus and smarts.

This game was an embarrassment for Meyer, JdV and Matfield. Piss poor. It needed smarts. We were like morons. Same shit from minute 41 as the first 40. It was like watching a train wreck in 80 minute slow motion.

Vokken dom.

Hell I cant agree more. It was so depressing I luckily forgot to watch WP getting reamed by Saracens.

 

[PaarlBok]

The other depressing factor was that Meyer had fourweeks to prepare this lot. They werent allowed to play CC rugby for their provinces. Thats why I just cant get it. He should know the winning formula is to pick players on form in the CC. Pretty sure those in his sqaud would have provide what was necessary.

 

[Dewald Nel]

Don't think your giving Ireland enough credit there. The Boks weren't beaten by some passionate manic effort, they were absolutely hammered by a clinical disciplined outfit. Joe Schmidt prepared his side perfectly and got his tactics and selection spot on, and gave the Boks the kind of shellacking that only BNZ have come close to in recent times.

There seems to be a lot of people in the Southern Hemisphere underestimating this Ireland side but with our coach, captain and half backs I think we're really good value for a long run the World Cup and worth a sneaky punt at 12/1.



I know Ruan Piennar isn't rated by a lot of Saffers but I reckon he'd have made a difference in this game. He would have taken a lot of pressure off Pollard whose tactical kicking game was poor.

Nah. If we played with the same intensity as we did during the rugby championship, and taken the points when we should have, I reckon we would have got there.

Just looked like we turned up expecting the Irish to fall over, which we really shouldn't have.

And Ruan Pienaar is way too slow. I know Hougaard's game was VERY off this weekend, but his off day still had nothing on Ruan Pienaar's off days.

Watch him bounce back against England. In fact, he was man of the match against New Zealand, and deservedly so. If he deserved to be dropped after Ellis Park, then we should start every weekend with a brand new team.

 

[Mank]

Nah. If we played with the same intensity as we did during the rugby championship, and taken the points when we should have, I reckon we would have got there.

Just looked like we turned up expecting the Irish to fall over, which we really shouldn't have.

I don't buy this theory of underestimating opponents. All of us on this board know we can't underestimate Ireland (or anyone really), we need focus and intensity in every test match. It doesn't make sense to suggest that Meyer and all the players are more stupid than us.

There is something more to it and I can't define it. The Springboks have established a very solid pattern now of playing poorly in the majority of their autumn NH tour matches, especially the first match of the tour. I don't know why this is but the pattern is most definitely there. I don't mean to sound like Mr. Hindsight but I said before the game (to friends) that it would come as no surprise if we lost, but my actual expectation was a poor game by the Springboks sneaking an undeserved win at the end. We have followed that pattern closely in our NH games for a long time now. In the end the poor play caught up with us in the form a good and fired up Irish side and we got deservedly spanked. Someone in our management setup needs to recognise this pattern and find a way to change it. Arrive a couple of weeks early in the NH and play some quality opposition? Get the poor games out the way? I don't know, but it's not my job to know. I'm just the guy who forked out £70 to watch that pile of junk.

To get more specific, here in three points is what I thought went wrong:
1) Reliance on single pass hit ups with a forward. Too easy to read now and Irish defended easily.
2) Reliance on Willie le Roux to create some magic. He ran sideways against an organised defence with no help in the form of decent angled running from the other backs.
3) Lack of momentum. Every time we started to build momentum the game would turn in the form of a knock-on or penalty against us. We could not impose anything on the game.

But this style of play in points 1 and 2 has "worked" for us in the past. It does not work when point 3 manifests and we can't build momentum. We need to do the basics very very well, and this is where the All Blacks excel.

How do we beat England next week? We will need the half-backs to play much better and we will need the team as a whole to be much more clinical. Eliminate the errors, try to get on the right side of the referee, get our patterns established, build some momentum and I think the Boks can win. Don't do that and we will definitely lose again. How do I predict the result? Easy, I don't have tickets to the next match and so I expect the Boks to win ;-)

 

[PaarlBok]

Sjoe I feel sorry for you to have watched that kak on the weekend. There is only one way we can beat England, we need to dominate them physcically. Thats where we beat them in the past. I have no idea if we are able to do this. England look good and will have confidense to beat us.

 

[ChargerWA]

What's recent form like between SA and Eng?

I can't remember last time you guys played each other and who won.