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Wales v Wallabies, Cardiff, Nov 30 2013

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terry j

terry j

Ron Walden (29)
Round 15 said:
With young kids, did not get up for the match. Then had a family day on. Made it to my couch to wath the replay at 8.30pm. Then I get some message about some golf show. As a result, I have not seen the test. Does not seem any replay will be coming on from now on.
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not as good as on the big screen, but youza a beggar no?:)
 
Braveheart81

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
KOB1987 said:
if that freeze frame is the best evidence they have of a bite then they are clutching at straws!! The bigger story is that (unsurprisingly) Phillips escaped any citing
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It seems that these incidents rarely ever get cited unless the team that it happens to makes an official complaint.

That pretty much never happens.
 
BDA

BDA

Peter Johnson (47)
Braveheart81 said:
Oh come on. Biting in self defence? Seriously?

He's not a wild animal fearing for its life.

I'm not for a second excusing Phillips behaviour, but biting someone in retaliation is never appropriate.
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If he genuinely believed the bite was necessary to avoid harm to himself, then it wouldn't be considered an excessive reaction.

I suspect cooper was merely trying to get Phillips' attention rather than actually sinking his teeth in with any force, so I see no problem with it.
 
BDA

BDA

Peter Johnson (47)
From recent interviews it sounds like Link hasn't forgotten about Palmer. Whilst he doesn't really fit the mould of the type of starting prop Link is looking for, I think Link would like him in his world cup squad none the less, most likely as a bench option.

I think it is important that we have at least 1 genuinely strong scrummaging TH as back up. Kepu is good, but Palmer would be a good addition
 
Braveheart81

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
BDA said:
If he genuinely believed the bite was necessary to avoid harm to himself, then it wouldn't be considered an excessive reaction.
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This isn't a common law situation on the street. If one person punches you and you punch them back you don't get a free pass because you were defending yourself.

On a rugby field retaliation is generally treated just as harshly as the initial offence.
 
wamberal

wamberal

Phil Kearns (64)
BDA said:
From recent interviews it sounds like Link hasn't forgotten about Palmer. Whilst he doesn't really fit the mould of the type of starting prop Link is looking for, I think Link would like him in his world cup squad none the less, most likely as a bench option.

I think it is important that we have at least 1 genuinely strong scrummaging TH as back up. Kepu is good, but Palmer would be a good addition
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If Palmer improves his general play, he would be an asset. But I would have thought the time to put your best scrummaging THP on the field is at the start of the match, when scrum dominance is being determined?


At the back end of most matches, the scrums start to even out a bit as replacements are made, players get tired, teams chase tries, etc. That's the time to bring on the mobile front rowers, I would have thought. Palmer will never be classed as a mobile front rower, unless something amazing happens.
 
BDA

BDA

Peter Johnson (47)
Braveheart81 said:
This isn't a common law situation on the street. If one person punches you and you punch them back you don't get a free pass because you were defending yourself.

On a rugby field retaliation is generally treated just as harshly as the initial offence.
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your quite right. I suppose I was talking from a street setting mentality, but those kind of general concepts which underpin our law (such as self defense) are worth consideration when putting people's behavoir in context
 
BDA

BDA

Peter Johnson (47)
wamberal said:
If Palmer improves his general play, he would be an asset. But I would have thought the time to put your best scrummaging THP on the field is at the start of the match, when scrum dominance is being determined?


At the back end of most matches, the scrums start to even out a bit as replacements are made, players get tired, teams chase tries, etc. That's the time to bring on the mobile front rowers, I would have thought. Palmer will never be classed as a mobile front rower, unless something amazing happens.
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I agree with this. at the same time you really do lose a lot by having a guy like Palmer on the field for 60 minutes, as oppose to a guy like Slipper. The impact round the field is chalk and cheese. I think this is why Link prefers Slipper to Robinson. By all means if we were going up against Adam Jones, then I suspect Link would probably look at starting Benn Robinson. Same goes for Palmer. I could see instances where you'd look at starting Palmer (maybe against Corbs) but provided our 8 scrummage as a unit I'd back the likes of Slipper and Kepu to measure up well against most of the top test props.

The flip side to your argument is that you have guys like robinson and palmer coming on in the final 20 minutes. They are more likely to make a good impact over a 20 minutes period than a 60 minute period, and you know that your set piece will be rock solid going into the final quarter when securing the ball will be paramount.
 
RugbyReg

RugbyReg

Rocky Elsom (76)
Staff member
imagine picking Palmer for that test though. First scrum was in the 2nd half. Is it more worth working on Slipper et als scrummaging than trying to make Palmer a workhorse around the field?
 
wamberal

wamberal

Phil Kearns (64)
RugbyReg said:
imagine picking Palmer for that test though. First scrum was in the 2nd half. Is it more worth working on Slipper et als scrummaging than trying to make Palmer a workhorse around the field?
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The ARU seems to agree with you, that's why Slipper is contracted and Palmer is not.

BTW, I was responding to an earlier post that said that Palmer would be a good substitute, I was simply pointing out that, if he is ever going to make the Test team again, it will be as a starting THP, because he will never be worth bringing on when the game opens up, as most games usually do.

So it's all or nothing for Palmer. Saturday's game was a rare exception, most games against the top countries, we face four or five, maybe more, scrums in the first half, and they can be crucial to the outcome of the match. Unfortunately for us, usually.
 
Zander

Zander

Ron Walden (29)
Loosehead seems to be a weak position in world rugby at the moment. Cian Healy would likely be his only challenger. Alex Corbisiero's knees are ruined.
 
Braveheart81

Braveheart81

Will Genia (78)
Staff member
Zander said:
Loosehead seems to be a weak position in world rugby at the moment. Cian Healy would likely be his only challenger. Alex Corbisiero's knees are ruined.
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Hard to argue that he is likely to be any better than Mtawarira or Oosthuizen in the next couple of years.

LHP seems to be a position that New Zealand is a bit weak at after Woodcock.
 
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