Super Rugby Round 2: Waratahs v Stormers
- Thread starter Hawko
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Ruggo
Mark Ella (57)
Tahs forward pack just lacks balance. Plenty of toilers but no real impact. One thing I liked about the Tahs game was the intent to be receiving the ball at pace. they made some good yards over the advantage line at times.
Hard to be critical of teams in round one but if they sort out that pack balance issue, they have real promise out wide.
Hard to be critical of teams in round one but if they sort out that pack balance issue, they have real promise out wide.
Whatever the question, it is unlikely Holloway is the answer
If we need another lock, pick a lock with actual workrate
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A mutterer
Chilla Wilson (44)
First game of the season its better to be lucky than good. Ill take it.
Micheal
Nicholas Shehadie (39)
So where to for next week? How long until Kepu and Dempsey are back? Likewise, what's the deal with Latu? Is his injured?
Otherwise:
+ I'd shift Newsome onto Kellaways wing, as I barely noticed Andrew was even on the field.
+ I'd reward Gordon for the strong performance, and reintroduce Phipps to the bench.
+ I thought Fitzpatrick, despite being about 35kg ringing wet, had a great game and showed some real urgency / leadership around the field.
+ Unfortunately, there's not a lot that we can do about the front row. I liked Vui and HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes), but they're still very green and should remain on the bench
+ Both Staniforth and Simmons were utterly un-inspiring. I wouldn't mind seeing Palmer getting a start, to see what he can do. Simmons to be retained to call the lineout.
+ Holloway showed more urgency on the field than Wells did, who also made some perplexing mistakes. Swap them.
+ A 6:2 bench could be favourable in SA given the travel. Swinton or Miller could be introduced via the bench. Swinton for more grunt, Miller to return them off their feet (Phipps and Gordon cover 9, Foley Beale and Hegarty cover 10, Rona Newsome Hegarty Phipps cover 11 and 14, Rona and Foketi cover 13, Foley Beale Folau Hegarty cover 15.
+ Not included, but I'd like to see Mason given some game time in coming weeks. Maybe a start against the Sunwolves, with Foley on the bench.
This gives us:
1 Robertson
2 Fitzpatrick
3 Ryan
4 Palmer
5 Simmons
6 Hanigan
7 Hooper (c)
8 Holloway
9 Gordon
10 Foley
11 Rona
12 Beale
13 Foketi
14 Newsome
15 Folau
16 Johnson-Holmes
17 Roach (Latu if fit)
18 Vui
19 Staniforth
20 Swinton / Miller
21 Wells
22 Phipps
23 Hegarty
Otherwise:
+ I'd shift Newsome onto Kellaways wing, as I barely noticed Andrew was even on the field.
+ I'd reward Gordon for the strong performance, and reintroduce Phipps to the bench.
+ I thought Fitzpatrick, despite being about 35kg ringing wet, had a great game and showed some real urgency / leadership around the field.
+ Unfortunately, there's not a lot that we can do about the front row. I liked Vui and HJH (Harry Johnson-Holmes), but they're still very green and should remain on the bench
+ Both Staniforth and Simmons were utterly un-inspiring. I wouldn't mind seeing Palmer getting a start, to see what he can do. Simmons to be retained to call the lineout.
+ Holloway showed more urgency on the field than Wells did, who also made some perplexing mistakes. Swap them.
+ A 6:2 bench could be favourable in SA given the travel. Swinton or Miller could be introduced via the bench. Swinton for more grunt, Miller to return them off their feet (Phipps and Gordon cover 9, Foley Beale and Hegarty cover 10, Rona Newsome Hegarty Phipps cover 11 and 14, Rona and Foketi cover 13, Foley Beale Folau Hegarty cover 15.
+ Not included, but I'd like to see Mason given some game time in coming weeks. Maybe a start against the Sunwolves, with Foley on the bench.
This gives us:
1 Robertson
2 Fitzpatrick
3 Ryan
4 Palmer
5 Simmons
6 Hanigan
7 Hooper (c)
8 Holloway
9 Gordon
10 Foley
11 Rona
12 Beale
13 Foketi
14 Newsome
15 Folau
16 Johnson-Holmes
17 Roach (Latu if fit)
18 Vui
19 Staniforth
20 Swinton / Miller
21 Wells
22 Phipps
23 Hegarty
Back home in the beautiful Blue Mountains after attending tonight's match. A few thoughts:
- The ground surface looked very good after all the crappy ones we've seen at Allianz over the years. It resembled a newly-sown lawn with a pale green shine on it, a bit too long for soccer and evenly-grassed over the whole pitch. A coupla scrums lifted up a few footmarks but there weren't any patches with wholesale damage. And no sand coming up in those footmarks.
- My pre-match fears about the front row were realised, unfortunately. Added to the front three the tight five were significantly lighter than the Stormers and it showed at the breakdown where the Tahs were out-muscled too many times. That Kitshoff's a beast, big (120kg), strong AND mobile. And he can catch a ball thrown at him........ My advice to the Tahs' coaches is this: choose a side for the props (I'd suggest 1 for Ryan and 3 for Robbo) AND LEAVE THEM THERE! And find some big bastards who like playing lock.
- How come with a multitude of players from the Force looking for a gig over east all we got was a winger and a young prop?, two slots where we really aren't short of local talent. What about a big lug for the second row? There were three good locks at the Force and we couldn't snag one of them, they went to the Rebels and Brumbies where their 2017 second row cupboards weren't exactly bare. The lack of physical grunt in our tight five will cost us this year. Latu, Kepu and Dempsey will go some way to addressing this concern but none of them play in the second row.
- Addressing the pigs first, Fitzpatrick and Han igan played well in the open, Robertson toiled away at the breakdown with some success, the second row and Wells were ineffective and Hooper was his usual energetic self. The replacement front row weren't much better in the scrums (OK, no better) although Roach was very active and physical in the open. Palmer and Holloway played quite effectively in the little time they had, in my opinion showing up the starters.
- Is Simmons required to do one stupid thing every match? He didn't let us, or himself, down there.
- Gordon, Beale and Folau were very good tonight, any one of these three would've been my MotM. Nice to see Kurtley underplaying his hand quite a few times. I was up the end where he went over under the posts, I thought his first touch of the ground when he slid over might've been a try yet Gardner and the TMO looked for a grounding when Kurtley tried to place the ball immediately afterwards.
- All the other backs, including Foley, had quiet games, Hegarty did a coupla good things when he came on but that was about it for all the other backs.
- Lineouts were good. Not surprising as Han igan is a very good lineout technician.
- Foley kicked well, nice to see.
- Far too much time was spent looking at contentious matters on the big screen. TMOs' involvements in matches needs to be addressed.
- That was a very arsey win, but I'll take it.
Brumby Runner
David Wilson (68)
KOB, take a good look at my comments. I have never rated Tom in attack. He runs the ball a lot in a game but makes no territory gain. His strength lies in his ability to hold up a runner to create a maul. He is also a better than average lineout operator especially on the opposition throw. Sounds a lot like Rob Simmons, doesn't it? Except he is stronger than Rob.
Tom had run his time at the Brumbies and will not be missed. On balance, just an average Super player, but sarcastically will be a good chance of making the Wallabies now that he wears a blue jumper.
I think KOB was talking about Holloway! Well, I think KOB was - WCR took it as meaning Staniforth. Now I'm confused.
Brumby Runner
David Wilson (68)
Thanks for that Cyclo, but KOB was actually referring to my opinion of Staniforth. I do agree with your comments about Holloway, but despite not yet having laid down a big marker, I believe he is the best option the Tahs have at No 8.
I have separately addressed KOB re Staniforth.
Jamie
Watty Friend (18)
Good points but let's enjoy the win, I don't know what the crowd number was but at least from where I was sitting (and standing!) it was a very vocal crowd which was nice to see. I think the Tahs put themselves in the position to win and luck has very little to do with it, 2017 Tahs loose that game any day!
I was under no illusions as to our forward pack, specially against such a big pack, let's see how they go in the next few rounds, again full credit to the boys for chasing the win! As far as Force players go, maybe they did not want to come to the Tahs...
So do I if he can up the fitness / workrate. I was surprised at him being raised as a lock option.
Froggy
John Solomon (38)
Really enjoyed that despite the typical early season mistake-fest from both sides. Biggest positive for me was the Tahs defence for 80 minutes, 100% up from last year (although that doesn't set the bar very high). I thought the backs generally were very good, with Beale the best, although I guess all that was to be expected. Ball security across the park was disappointing, although the same could be said for the Stormers.
The big worry is the tight five. 2nd row offered nothing, front row, particularly Robertson, were monstered. We will lose more than we win if the scrum doesn't massively improve. Kepu will help, but he's only one guy. And I'm inclined to think it doesn't matter who is in the front row if they are getting no weight from the locks.
Just a comment on Hanigan, who was copping a bit of a bagging during the game. It's become a bit of a right of passage here to criticise him (and at test level I tend to agree) but I didn't think he was too bad last night. Not MOTM, but was excellent in the lineout, took a wonderful take off our kick-off to retain the ball, scored that last try with real determination, and generally worked hard all night. Certainly not our biggest problem, unlike the five guys in front of him.
The big worry is the tight five. 2nd row offered nothing, front row, particularly Robertson, were monstered. We will lose more than we win if the scrum doesn't massively improve. Kepu will help, but he's only one guy. And I'm inclined to think it doesn't matter who is in the front row if they are getting no weight from the locks.
Just a comment on Hanigan, who was copping a bit of a bagging during the game. It's become a bit of a right of passage here to criticise him (and at test level I tend to agree) but I didn't think he was too bad last night. Not MOTM, but was excellent in the lineout, took a wonderful take off our kick-off to retain the ball, scored that last try with real determination, and generally worked hard all night. Certainly not our biggest problem, unlike the five guys in front of him.
I agree regarding the second row - it looked like there was little grunt coming through in the scrums. The scrum woes weren't all in the FR.
I ran into Paddy Ryan at a charity golf day towards the end of last year. He was saying that with the current scrum "regulations" he found LHP much easier and more comfortable with his height than THP, which was where he played more earlier. Funny to see him switched back to THP when it looked he was faring better at LHP last year.
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
I thought the Stormers put up a phenomenal defensive effort, they played right to the last gasp, even though they must have been suffering from the long flight.
WorkingClassRugger
David Codey (61)
He was the same in the NRC. Plenty of touches but no actual impact in the contact zone.
Fixed. It's more than just the FR (which struggled for sure).
wamberal
Phil Kearns (64)
Has to be one of the weakest tight fives for a long time. Allied with a mobile, but tiny, back row. How the fark did we win?
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