Reds 2023

[RugbyReg]

Well it’s clear we have to do some heavy recruiting in the off-season.

I, and a few others, noted the stale looking nature of this years squad. Not much turnover which is often needed to keep the team environment fresh.

What is now clear is not only do we need to freshen up the squad but we need to proactively recruit super ready players and not just rely on the pathway. Even if the focus is on bringing Qlders home (Kerevi, Hockings, Lucas, Tafa, McMahon, Vella, Banks, Van Nek, Hosea, Wilkin, Tuttle, Gordon, Kaitu’u, Wagner, Rodda, etc)

Perhaps time for some new voices too.

 

[Cancelled Account]

Well it’s clear we have to do some heavy recruiting in the off-season.

I, and a few others, noted the stale looking nature of this years squad. Not much turnover which is often needed to keep the team environment fresh.

What is now clear is not only do we need to freshen up the squad but we need to proactively recruit super ready players and not just rely on the pathway. Even if the focus is on bringing Qlders home (Kerevi, Hockings, Lucas, Tafa, McMahon, Vella, Banks, Van Nek, Hosea, Wilkin, Tuttle, Gordon, Kaitu’u, Wagner, Rodda, etc)

Perhaps time for some new voices too.

I couldn’t agree with you more. And looking at that list would suggest building a bridge with a particular player agent. Time to drop the egos and do what is needed. Watching the game tonight, I was thinking about the players we have got coming through the academy and who we can draw on from QPR, which got me nervous for the next couple of years.

 

[Wilson]

Whatever recruiting we do we desperately need to find some higher level game time for the guys below wallaby level between this season and next. The drop in quality and cohesion has been so stark for many of the squad players coming through, we need to get ahead of that before next year.

If there's no formal competition, which seems unlikely at this stage, I'd love to see 3-5 games booked in after the club season. A tour of Japan, New Zealand or South Africa would be ideal, though maybe to expensive. Maybe Tonga/Samoa would be interested in games while they still struggle to book proper test matches? Hell even a 3 match series of City vs Country would be better than nothing.

 

[PhilClinton]

I couldn’t agree with you more. And looking at that list would suggest building a bridge with a particular player agent. Time to drop the egos and do what is needed.

What is needed is a large bag of unmarked money to be dropped on RA doorstep so we can retain all the players.

Fair enough repairing a relationship will help - but if my player is being offered $200k more to play overseas, I’m making sure they take that offer.

Depth is an issue across all Aussie clubs, it is just cyclical. The fringe blokes who are making the Brumbies and Tahs stand out this year will be picked off over the next few seasons.

The Reds problems run far deeper than a personal recruitment issue.

 

[RugbyReg]

Yeah. I know that’s on the cards Wilson. Some exciting plans but some barriers to overcome.

 

[dru]

Well it’s clear we have to do some heavy recruiting in the off-season.

I, and a few others, noted the stale looking nature of this years squad. Not much turnover which is often needed to keep the team environment fresh.

What is now clear is not only do we need to freshen up the squad but we need to proactively recruit super ready players and not just rely on the pathway. Even if the focus is on bringing Qlders home (Kerevi, Hockings, Lucas, Tafa, McMahon, Vella, Banks, Van Nek, Hosea, Wilkin, Tuttle, Gordon, Kaitu’u, Wagner, Rodda, etc)

Perhaps time for some new voices too.

Unless your recruitment has a sideline to the coaching set up I'm not sure I agree. We have some awesome talent, and a fabulous broader squad. I'm not seeing the 23 - 40 as the problem.

@ RReg, honest, you see this as recruitment?

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Yeah. I know that’s on the cards Wilson. Some exciting plans but some barriers to overcome.

Care to share those exciting plans

 

[RugbyReg]

Care to share those exciting plans

No

 

[RugbyReg]

Unless your recruitment has a sideline to the coaching set up I'm not sure I agree. We have some awesome talent, and a fabulous broader squad. I'm not seeing the 23 - 40 as the problem.

@ RReg, honest, you see this as recruitment?

Yes. How can you not? You can’t consistently lose Super Rugby talent and rely solely on the system to replace them and expect to be at Super Rugby Pacific level.

 

[Cancelled Account]

No

A teams?

 

[Rugbynutter39]

No

Teaser

 

[Wilson]

Unless your recruitment has a sideline to the coaching set up I'm not sure I agree. We have some awesome talent, and a fabulous broader squad. I'm not seeing the 23 - 40 as the problem.

@ RReg, honest, you see this as recruitment?

I don't have a major issue with our existing coaches, but I'd love to see a lineout specialist bought in. It's far and away the weakest area of our game and is probably the easiest gains available to us regardless of squad changes. Ben Mowen looks like the obvious candidate from the Brisbane scene, but I'm sure there are plenty of options from further afield too.

 

[Rugbynutter39]

Yes. How can you not? You can’t consistently lose Super Rugby talent and rely solely on the system to replace them and expect to be at Super Rugby Pacific level.

I wonder if reds not developing the talent as well as say a brumbies. I think the reds also got a lot more out of nrc to develop players and really missing this.

Just speculation from me as not close to reds as persons like yourself.

 

[liquor box]

I don't have a major issue with our existing coaches, but I'd love to see a lineout specialist bought in. It's far and away the weakest area of our game and is probably the easiest gains available to us regardless of squad changes. Ben Mowen looks like the obvious candidate from the Brisbane scene, but I'm sure there are plenty of options from further afield too.

Maybe we should only sign players who are capable of being effective in the lineout rather than trying to train them once they get to Super Rugby.

This could possibly be achieved by using someone like Mowen to run training sessions for club players who are trying to get a pro contract, make them work to earn their spot rather than being recruited with gaps in their game.

 

[liquor box]

Well it’s clear we have to do some heavy recruiting in the off-season.

I, and a few others, noted the stale looking nature of this years squad. Not much turnover which is often needed to keep the team environment fresh.

What is now clear is not only do we need to freshen up the squad but we need to proactively recruit super ready players and not just rely on the pathway. Even if the focus is on bringing Qlders home (Kerevi, Hockings, Lucas, Tafa, McMahon, Vella, Banks, Van Nek, Hosea, Wilkin, Tuttle, Gordon, Kaitu’u, Wagner, Rodda, etc)

Perhaps time for some new voices too.

The focus should be on the best team possible, not where someone was born. Focussing on Queensland players is a nice return to amateur days but we need to recruit to win, this should be the only consideration.

 

[Wilson]

Maybe we should only sign players who are capable of being effective in the lineout rather than trying to train them once they get to Super Rugby.

This could possibly be achieved by using someone like Mowen to run training sessions for club players who are trying to get a pro contract, make them work to earn their spot rather than being recruited with gaps in their game.

So we don't develop players then? We'd have to be massively out spending the competition to get a squad full of players who are all ready to go at super level and we just don't have that kind of money. Even if we did there's a salary cap we're dealing with that wouldn't allow for it. The reality is all players are coming into super rugby with deficiencies in their game, that's replicated across the Australian sides and even New Zealand (though to a lesser extent).

What we do have is one of the largest player bases of any of the sides in super rugby, our best path to success is building a system that brings them through reliably and efficiently. Having the lineout coach (or any other specialist) working with the fringe players in the club scene as you suggest is great, but if we're not signing them as we start to develop them we will have lost them to other teams before we get a chance to use them.

It also goes beyond technical ability and development, it's about strategy, both defensively and offensively. Having someone who knows it through and through could absolutely give us a boost there, same as we get from other areas of coaching.

 

[LeCheese]

The focus should be on the best team possible, not where someone was born. Focussing on Queensland players is a nice return to amateur days but we need to recruit to win, this should be the only consideration.

Absolutely, but I don't think the value of having a larger 'sense of purpose' and allegiance to something greater than the team should be overlooked. It's pretty clear that Thorn has really pushed the 'Queensland' culture within the Reds (which is obviously easier to achieve/align with when you've got players Qld born and bred), and it's seemed to have helped them on a number of occasions when the chips have been down. I know it's a cliché, but there is some science behind it.

 

[Cancelled Account]

The Reds are assisted substantially with scouting through the GPS school system. It’s the school scouts that travel the state (and outside QLD) to find athletes to offer scholarships and bursaries. These are usually offered to families that cannot afford to send their kids to these schools. If I was the Reds, I would be re-establishing relationships with the GPS schools and encouraging the rugby programs so that the schools continue to absorb these scouting expenses.
We have all of these talented rugby league stars (past and present) who played rugby right here in Brisbane under our noses and then we let them go. Where were the Reds with grooming these players and offering contracts like the NRL? We just don’t do enough.

The State School system is the key. Why doesn’t Queensland Rugby and/or AR have a committee whose sole purpose is to get rugby into State Schools? Baffling. Surely with all us rich rugby folk and knowing the right people in government we can obtain the funds to get this moving. Lots of talk, but no serious planning.
IT IS ALL ABOUT QUANTITY OF REGISTRATIONS AND FUNDING.

 

[Cancelled Account]

My order for 2023:
C. Gordon
J. Hansen
J. Tuttle
Based on players not known to be signed and all from QLD.

 

[PhilClinton]

My order for 2023:
C. Gordon
J. Hansen
J. Tuttle
Based on players not known to be signed and all from QLD.

Carter Gordon obviously makes sense as an immediate flyhalf solve for 2023 and beyond, but why bother signing the Lynagh kid if you're going after him? Unless we are happy for Lynagh to be getting paid big boy salary for the duration of his contract whilst sitting on the bench.

Hansen and Tuttle I'm not so sure - Hansen will be 35, if the Reds can hold onto Mafi, Nasser and Asiata do we need Hansen? I think we will know more about Mafi's future in the coming weeks so maybe Hansen will find a spot.

Bobby Tuttle would be a decent backup, but does he offer more than Kalani and Spencer Jeans? Hard to say and the upside of those two playing another season of Super Rugby will only help their development.