How to fix the wallabies

[wamberal]

Lindommer,

You might as well save your breath. Club rugby in Sydney has always been about self-interest.


Even back in the days when you had to represent the club for which you were residentially qualified. As a kid growing up in the Eastwood district in the days when we could not win anything, and lost players galore to Gordon and Parramatta -- who were both far more successful, that was just the way it was. It took us just on 50 years to win our first First Grade Premiership, and 14 years to win anything (Thirsty Thirds in 1962).

I don't recall anybody calling for us to get help. And that is the way community sport works. Parramatta used to be bloody strong, when they had a strong rugby community. Penrith had a pretty handy side too at one stage.


(On the residential front, I met a chap in Tonga who had played first grade with Gordon, partnering Trevor Allen in the centres. He told me that he had actually been residentially qualified to play for Eastwood, but had been assisted to get a fake Gordon address).

Not to mention the player payments and other inducements that certain successful clubs were notorious for back in the shamateur days.


Self-interest is the only reliable motivator in amateur sport, and that is what club rugby is, virtually.

I would love to see the Penrith rugby community support their club. Why don't they? That is the question that should be being asked, and answered.


By the way, nobody was more delighted than me when we lost both games against Parramatta this year, even if it meant that we had to face the Corporation at their home ground in the semis.

 

[dru]

Have to congratulate everyone on how this thread is evolving. Moving away from an ARU (or Papwoth or East coast or whatever) polemic.

In thinking about governance, I quite like the structure of the NSWRU-Waratahs Ltd. It separates (or should do) the RU from the commerical elements.

I dont like the structure of the NSW Premer comp, where the SRU intervenes between SS and NSWRU; and leads to confusion with operation of the NRC. The intermitent attacks on the ARU from this sector are not just distracting, but I believe them to be very damaging to Australian rugby. Ditto the SS arrogation of the term "Grass roots".

FWIW, if the ARU were to reduce funding to elements of the professional game in order to better fund local Development Officers, this could be worthwhile pain. Presuming "pissing it up against a wall" was avoided.

One final concern. Viva, 7's etc. are we spreading ourselves too thin?

 

[dru]

As a counter to liking the governance structure in NSW (or parts of it) I love the actual effectiveness of centralisation in Qld. No not the Reds performances. The commonality and consistency of theme, through press release, internet, marketing etc, that runs through Reds, NRC, Premier, Grade, Grass Roots.

I have no idea how it is actually working at the coal face, but I love the streaming through different levels, reprting consistently to all levels. The QRU are to be congratulated.

 

[Forcefield]

The whole team should sit down and watch the hit film "How Stella got her Groove Back" and take notes.

 

[wamberal]

For those who don't agree that club rugby is about self-interest, try this little hypothetical.


You are the president of a pretty successful club. One of your members is rich. He comes to you one day and says: "Gidday mate. I have decided that I want to put a bit of money into the game at the grass-roots. I am willing to put in $100k each year for the next five years".


You say:

1. Thanks Kevin. We can really use it.

2. No thanks Kevin. Give half each to Parramatta and Penrith. They are the ones who really need it.

 

[Gnostic]

For those who don't agree that club rugby is about self-interest, try this little hypothetical.





You are the president of a pretty successful club. One of your members is rich. He comes to you one day and says: "Gidday mate. I have decided that I want to put a bit of money into the game at the grass-roots. I am willing to put in $100k each year for the next five years".





You say:



1. Thanks Kevin. We can really use it.



2. No thanks Kevin. Give half each to Parramatta and Penrith. They are the ones who really need it.

If I am the president of the club what is my first responsibility? What am I ethically bound to do?

If I am the donor and I go to a CLUB president offering money who am I targeting? If I go to the organisers of the Competition on the other hand. Sorry Wamberal you hypothetical is crap.

 

[wamberal]

If I am the president of the club what is my first responsibility? What am I ethically bound to do?

If I am the donor and I go to a CLUB president offering money who am I targeting? If I go to the organisers of the Competition on the other hand. Sorry Wamberal you hypothetical is crap.

Use your imagination. Or spend a bit of time explaining this to those who attack Pappy.


Or, hypothetically, the Club President loves the game so much that he takes the selfless option. Maybe he has carte blanche from his board. Maybe he takes it to them, and they agree.

 

[Buggins]

Bring back Ben Mowen - a real leader

 

[Lorenzo]

unless Eastwood's financial situation has changed remarkably since I was last in the loop, Pappworth has a full plate dealing with keeping that club alive, never mind being altruistic to other clubs for the benefit of the Comp and the wider sport.

I don't think blowing up the system will help Australian rugby or Eastwood but I understand where he comes from

 

[Pfitzy]

Until we accept that all parts of the game have a part to play and that some are no longer "Premier" we will see these results.

 

[I like to watch]

For those who don't agree that club rugby is about self-interest, try this little hypothetical.


You are the president of a pretty successful club. One of your members is rich. He comes to you one day and says: "Gidday mate. I have decided that I want to put a bit of money into the game at the grass-roots. I am willing to put in $100k each year for the next five years".


You say:

1. Thanks Kevin. We can really use it.

2. No thanks Kevin. Give half each to Parramatta and Penrith. They are the ones who really need it.

In real life, the guy says if I chucked in $100k,how much would it improve the side next year?
If, unbelievably he was told, thanks mate but we will struggle on with what we've got.
Why don't you offer it to the Riff.
.... don't worry about it, I'll keep it thanks.

 

[Highlander35]

Reckon all Premier Clubs should get equal funding. Not based on player numbers or number of grades or state, just equal funding.

 

[Strewthcobber]

Reckon all Premier Clubs should get equal funding. Not based on player numbers or number of grades or state, just equal funding.

Funding from who?

 

[dru]

Funding from who?

Thats the question. Right now it comes from the State RU. And by definition those funds are not available for the grass roots.

Let the Premier clubs pull in their own sponsorship, no problem with that, and not bothered if some are better at sponsers than others. But be careful with funding from the RU that is taken away from the grass roots.

 

[Quick Hands]

Thats the question. Right now it comes from the State RU. And by definition those funds are not available for the grass roots.

Let the Premier clubs pull in their own sponsorship, no problem with that, and not bothered if some are better at sponsers than others. But be careful with funding from the RU that is taken away from the grass roots.

They do pull their own sponsorship. Funding from above stopped one or two years ago.

 

[dru]

They do pull their own sponsorship. Funding from above stopped one or two years ago.

I'm listening. This is not my strong suit. What does this say: http://www.nswrugby.com.au/Portals/...RU Annual Report (8MB RS Version Amended).pdf

To the non-expert seems to suggest $700k from NSWRU to Premier rugby in 2015. 2016 is not out yet I dont believe. From recollection 2014 was a lot more.

Edit: page 46 for $numbers

 

[Quick Hands]

I'm listening. This is not my strong suit. What does this say: http://www.nswrugby.com.au/Portals/35/assets/documents/2016/2015 NSWRU Annual Report (8MB RS Version Amended).pdf

To the non-expert seems to suggest $700k from NSWRU to Premier rugby in 2015. 2016 is not out yet I dont believe. From recollection 2014 was a lot more.

Edit: page 46 for $numbers

Think you'll find that is the cost of running the competition. I assumed that the previous discussion concerned funding = grants to run clubs.

 

[dru]

Think you'll find that is the cost of running the competition. I assumed that the previous discussion concerned funding = grants to run clubs.

The NSWRU is funding Shute Shield. Where are those funds going to come from if "funding from the above stopped a couple of years ago"? BTW didnt I also read that NSWRU has kicked in with another $300k to keep broadcasting going? Big money.

The next step is to look at how many players are registered with the SS clubs, and how many outside of this. And compare how $ per player is skewed to the SS.

But hell, why consider this when the easy route is to criticise the ARU.

Or like Papworth, carefully time a rant with the start of the NRC, looking to destroy anything positive in Australian rugby in the belief that if he tears it down, the SS traditional clubs can pick it up.

If I was engaged in Grass Roots rugby in NSW I'd be querying very hard, any funding to the SRU/SS that exceeds $/player in Grass Roots.

 

[cyclopath]

Is this all really on point with regards to "How to Fix The Wallabies"? As edifying as it is. Are we getting a bit sidetracked?

 

[dru]

Lets go again.

http://www.nswrugby.com.au/Portals/35/NSWRugby/NSW Rugby-web.pdf?timestamp=1430699963641

This time p35. Again circa $730k to SS compared to $800k o community rugby. I take "community" to roughly equate "grass roots" in this arrangement. So roughly same-same funding to Papworth and his cronies. (Guess what, the NSWRU has to fund other comps too).

From recollection some 2,500 players in those SS clubs? (I'll bet those SS clubs get community funding for the age groups where they have them.) and from recollection some 7,500 players across the rest of Sydney?

So roughly 3:1 funding to SS on $/player basis than the grass roots players. Hoes that make you feel? You grass roots blokes, wondering where you playing fees are going? Happy to be funding The Premier Comp?

But HELL, lets just rant at the ARU and threaten to tear the joint down.

Every time that Papworth issues a presser, rugby futures in aus go down a couple of points.