Reds v Force Rd 8 2014

[brokendown]

under the laws of the game,please tell me where the ref got it wrong?

 

[gel]

Both players were going for the ball. There is nothing wrong with that.

Under the laws of the game, it is illegal to tackle the player in the air, but that is not what Placid did. He made contact with the legs of the jumper, but that was with his chest- he did not tap, pull or push Morahan.

He was going for the ball. The ball was what he was going for. It was the ball he was going for. Going for the ball, he was. The ball, going for, he was.

Therefore, it shouldn't have been a penalty.

 

[I like to watch]

Only if he was going for the ball.

 

[Scoey]

If you don't think he was going for the ball can you offer some other explanation for what he was doing?
It would've been equally as sensible to penalise the Force player for striking another player with his knee.


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[Bairdy]

It's one thing to say he was going for the ball, but apart from having his eyes on the ball, he didn't get up and challenge in the air.

In that case, he's playing him in the air and Placid caused Hayward to land as awkward as he did. It was careless no doubt, but it's still a penalty.





10.4 (i) Tackling the jumper in the air. A player must not tackle nor tap, push or pull the foot or feet of an opponent jumping for the ball in a lineout or in open play.

Sanction: Penalty kick

In the referee decisions thread, a similar scenario was brought up, which occurred in the Ulster v Saracens game and a player was red carded. Certainly I'm not saying Placid deserves a red but a penalty is not unreasonable.

 

[ChargerWA]

I haven't looked up the wording of the law, but it has always been refereed with the intent that the man in the air must be protected.

There can't be the situation allowed where a player who is no position to actually mark the ball (Placid in this instance, who was still on the ground) can clatter into the man in the air, taking his legs out and risking serious injury then use the defence he kept his eyes on the ball.

There must be awareness of the opposing player and if the second player isn't in the position to mark the ball, they must stop, wait for the player to land and then tackle them.

Edit: Beaten but Bairdy.

 

[Bairdy]

And it's a bit disingenous to say that he because Placid didn't tap, push or pull Hayward's legs with his hands or arms, that he is precluded from being penalised. I wasn't aware you couldn't tap or push someone with your chest/torso?

 

[ChargerWA]

Truthfully, Placid was lucky not to be yellow carded.

 

[Tomikin]

Young kid had a rough start no intention but just excited

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[Scoey]

10.4 doesn't apply because he wasn't tackling Hayward. He was contesting the ball. This is an important thing to distinguish because otherwise this rule would apply to all similar contests regardless of whether either player was on the ground. In an event where both players jump for the ball and one taps the others legs (which happens almost every time) it should be a penalty there also. This is clearly not the intent of the law.
If you're looking at it simply as whose actions were more reckless then Hayward jumping into the air at an incoming player in a position where his knees make contact with the other players chest. That is also pretty reckless. I'm not saying he should've been penalised of course what I'm saying is that what happened, happens in rugby from time to time and Jonah shouldn't have been penalised. He didn't break a law.


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[gel]

He was going for the ball. He only had eyes for the ball. He wasn't tackling.

Anyway - someone else can discuss this if they want to. I have said my bit and to be honest, given the bile I have read on twf.com.au, the roar, GAGR blog, foxsports and some of the crap in this thread I am inclined at this point to think you guys are just shit stirring further and that I am just being trolled.

 

[No4918]

under the laws of the game,please tell me where the ref got it wrong?

Both the TMO and ref said both players were going for the ball. The ref then said that Placid had a duty not to bump into the opposing player. Go and check the replays, he said it at least twice. Personally never heard of that one and will be happy if you can show me the relevant law or where it has been penalised before.

 

[No4918]

It's one thing to say he was going for the ball, but apart from having his eyes on the ball, he didn't get up and challenge in the air.

In that case, he's playing him in the air and Placid caused Hayward to land as awkward as he did. It was careless no doubt, but it's still a penalty.

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10.4 (i) Tackling the jumper in the air. A player must not tackle nor tap, push or pull the foot or feet of an opponent jumping for the ball in a lineout or in open play.

Sanction: Penalty kick

In the referee decisions thread, a similar scenario was brought up, which occurred in the Ulster v Saracens game and a player was red carded. Certainly I'm not saying Placid deserves a red but a penalty is not unreasonable.

If you watch the whole thing it is clear Placid jumped late and his arms were coming up to catch the ball. It looked like he was unaware of where the Force player was and surprised that he was beaten to the jump.

There was nothing in it.

 

[emuarse]

I haven't looked up the wording of the law, but it has always been refereed with the intent that the man in the air must be protected.

There can't be the situation allowed where a player who is no position to actually mark the ball (Placid in this instance, who was still on the ground) can clatter into the man in the air, taking his legs out and risking serious injury then use the defence he kept his eyes on the ball.

There must be awareness of the opposing player and if the second player isn't in the position to mark the ball, they must stop, wait for the player to land and then tackle them.

Edit: Beaten but Bairdy.

If two opposing players have their eye on the ball, both jump for it not realising the opposing player is doing the same, then that in any other code (league,AFL) would not be penalised.
Any referee in rugby who is competent (e.g. Joubert) would not have given a penalty for this.

p.s. this is not menat as an indictment on the referee for this game

 

[EatSleepDrinkRuck]

God f^%king dammit.

In light of my shit talking - please observe my new avatar and team.

 

[Penguin]

Perhaps you should do a little homework and check out the guys who have been toiling away for several years in Perth (aka Hodgo, Wykes), and the WA boys who are coming through the ranks.

"Buy a championship by poaching other teams star players", indeed. Please explain who the "star players" are in the Force side that have been poached? Not to mention that it's a fully professional game with players transferring all over the map.

So, what is your point?

It's kind of humorous, listening the the Reds fans on this forum. "The Reds are going to smash them!" But, ah, where and how are they going to beat them? "Um, because, arggghh, ummmm.. because they're THE REDS. Don't you know we won the Super Rugby Championship in 2011 (after years of mediocrity)?!!"

I wasn't saying that the Force were trying to buy a championship Just trying to point out to earlier posters the the Reds aren't a team full of champions, but they have been & like the Force are vying to be a champion team. It seems the FOrce are doing a better job at that at the moment

& because you appear to be new to the game.... the Reds had a few years of mediocrity before the Championship year & have been there abouts since. But look at the history mate..... plenty of good years through the preceding decades.

 

[Braveheart81]

Both the TMO and ref said both players were going for the ball. The ref then said that Placid had a duty not to bump into the opposing player. Go and check the replays, he said it at least twice. Personally never heard of that one and will be happy if you can show me the relevant law or where it has been penalised before.

I think it was definitely a penalty. Whilst Placid was only looking at the ball, he didn't make it to the contest in time and all he achieved was to take a player out in the air dangerously.

Your attempt at the ball has to be realistic otherwise you can't say that he's actually going for the ball. Hayward caught the ball in the air uncontested and then Placid arrived late, didn't get off the ground and just took Hayward out in the air.

Whether or not he is attempting to make a tackle is irrelevant. The player in the air needs to be protected and just because the player to arrive a distant second didn't take the player out intentionally doesn't make their player any less dangerous or careless.

 

[GaffaCHinO]

If two opposing players have their eye on the ball, both jump for it not realising the opposing player is doing the same, then that in any other code (league,AFL) would not be penalised.
Any referee in rugby who is competent (e.g. Joubert) would not have given a penalty for this.

p.s. this is not menat as an indictment on the referee for this game

Actually what Placid did the AFL call tunnelling and is a penalty every day of the week.

 

[EatSleepDrinkRuck]

Yeah, I'm not sure how you can say its not a penalty.

That said, I wouldn't be citing the bloke over it.

 

[Scoey]

Law 10.4 refers to a tackle. It wasn't a tackle as regardless of the outcome or how well he did it, he was contesting the ball.

It's Rugby not AFL.

And it's not a penalty because he did not break the laws.


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