Waratahs V Reds July 13 2013

[No4918]

Hmmm they must be keeping F'Sautia on ice as he played for Souths last weekend.

Mike Harris' inclusion must be based on his form for Uni, or that Fainga'a is being kept fresh for the finals.

Was going to ask about them. Has been a long time since Harris has played for them so getting some time under the belt before the finals might be the idea.

Still plenty of talent without Ioane. Next year with CFS on the wing and Shipperley or Davies still struggles for time with 2 guys gone. Really need a 15 more than anything in the backs.

 

[Tangawizi]

Didn't Harris kick 12 from 12 a couple of weekends ago?

Probably won't be much use chasing Bonus Points this weekend for either side so this will just be about getting the win.

So if there's a penalty on offer, I think Harris will stepping up and knocking it over.

 

[rugbysmartarse]

Waratahs:

1 - Robbo
2 - Ulugia
3 - Kepu
4 - Timani
5 - Douglas
6 - Holloway
7 - Hooper
8 - Dennis
9 - McKibbin
10 - Foley
11 - Kingston
12 - Barnes
13 - Horne
14 - Betham
15 - Crawford

Reserves: TBA

 

[barbarian]

Going from the Lions to the Reds/Tahs is like spending three weeks with Jennifer Hawkins, then having to go back to the good looking bird at work. Normally you'd be pretty happy with yourself, but after spending all that time with Hawkins it just doesn't excite you like you know it should.......
.

 

[Hell West & Crooked]

The good news is that Australian Rugby can't lose at ANZ stadium this Saturday night

The bad news is that, true to type, the Wallabies playing in this game will play out of their skins and have a blinder.

Either way this promises to be a cracker. Waratahs are out of finals contention and are playing for pride - this will be no issue with Cheik. Reds are playing for a home final and aiming to go two-up for the Templeton cup.

Interesting clashes will be in the back row, with Hooper and Gill facing off, and Bernard Foley up against Quade (who surely has a point to prove).

Last game of the year, in Sydney, can't help but feel the Tahs will be right up for it. (I am prone to heavy bias though).

So you have noticed it too... this bizarre - and consistent - characteristic of Wallaby players to simply "not show up" for big event matches, and then play blinders even just a week later, when there is absolutely 'nothing on the table'... the real psychological reasons for this are the key to about 75% of the teams' problems...

If I had had to watch Mortlock and Gregan turn up and interviews and say "We tried hard, but fell a bit short today..." one more time, I might have switched to AFL.

Still, since then there have been various Bledisloe Cups, RWC versus Ireland, RWC versus NZ, Wobbs versus Lions... You can almost predict when they will play well, and when they will not, simply by the importance of the match. There is also Scotland-Samoa-Scotland on the other hand (just to prove that nothing relating to mindset is ever simple and straightforward).

 

[Braveheart81]

Hell West & Crooked - I think it's a reflection that players aren't robots and are prone to feeling pressure and having good and bad days just like everyone else.

The very few players who are consistently good everytime they take the field are few and far between and that's why they're the best players in the game. It's not like it's an easy thing to achieve.

I don't think it has anything to do with lack of trying.

 

[fatprop]

Waratahs:

1 - Robbo
2 - Ulugia
3 - Kepu
4 - Timani
5 - Douglas
6 - Holloway
7 - Hooper
8 - Dennis
9 - McKibbin
10 - Foley
11 - Kingston
12 - Barnes
13 - Horne
14 - Betham
15 - Crawford

Reserves: TBA

Funny side to me, not real sure on the backs

 

[Hell West & Crooked]

Hell West & Crooked - I think it's a reflection that players aren't robots and are prone to feeling pressure and having good and bad days just like everyone else.

The very few players who are consistently good everytime they take the field are few and far between and that's why they're the best players in the game. It's not like it's an easy thing to achieve.

I don't think it has anything to do with lack of trying.

partially why I think the real problems are so complex... I don't think its lack of trying either - I think it is twofold;

1. Trying - but with a limited vision of what you CAN achieve - (put simply, whether you really think you can win or not)... example - English tennis players until last week / English Cricket teams for around 21 years - not now).

2. Ability to accept second-place as an option- many are okay with that, only a relative few cannot accept it.

The All Blacks are not Robots - but they Rarely ever accept that they are going to not win a game... mentally, they 'see no reason' to lose a game. It is a very different mindset to "we tried hard, but fell short (month-in, month out)... An All-Black Team would have gone on to win after pulling back within 3 points (9 times out of 10) - no-one watching the Wallabies could honestly argue they were fully confident in their ability to go on with it, at that same point (as a culture).

The (old) Australian cricket team are not robots - but they also rarely ever entered a game not believing they would walk away with a win, and keep in mind that this mindset had to be maintained for 5 long, consecutive days at a time - not just 90 minutes.

Roger Federer at his peak, was no Robot.
Mick Doohan was no robot.
Kelly Slater is no robot.

Finally, keep in mind, that we are talking about a team with only a 56 - 58% win rate - and I am suggesting the reasons why this is not 55, 65 or 75% is mental - its not ability. You simply cannot watch them play so often like Champions the week AFTER a series is lost, and not take notice of what your eyes and ears are telling you.

This is not to say they are bad, lazy or not trying - it is simply acknowledging something very clear in Australian Rugby that is little talked about. To me, it has been a clear trend since the late 90s / early noughties.

 

[Braveheart81]

The (old) Australian cricket team are not robots - but they also rarely ever entered a game not believing they would walk away with a win, and keep in mind that this mindset had to be maintained for 5 long, consecutive days at a time - not just 90 minutes.

Roger Federer at his peak, was no Robot.
Mick Doohan was no robot.
Kelly Slater is no robot.

Finally, keep in mind, that we are talking about a team with only a 56 - 58% win rate - and I am suggesting the reasons why this is not 55, 65 or 75% is mental - its not ability. You simply cannot watch them play so often like Champions the week AFTER a series is lost, and not take notice of what your eyes and ears are telling you.

This is not to say they are bad, lazy or not trying - it is simply acknowledging something very clear in Australian Rugby that is little talked about. To me, it has been a clear trend since the late 90s / early noughties.

That was our greatest cricket team ever and included the two best bowlers we've ever produced, the second best batsman Australia has ever produced, and the best wicketkeeper/batsman ever in international cricket. There was a reason they never entered a game not believing they were going to win. They were better than their opposition and there were enough excellent players that pretty much always enough players did enough to win the game.

Federer, Doohan and Slater are either one of or are the greatest in their sport ever.

I think you're comparing apples and oranges to a large degree.

I don't think it is purely mental that the Wallabies aren't the best team in the world.

 

[JSRF10]

Funny side to me, not real sure on the backs

Most of our best play has come from Foley getting the ball to our back 3 as quickly as possible, yes Izzy isn't there but I still think that backline is going to cause the Reds a lot of problems of set piece and turn over ball. Lets not forget some of the awesome attacking work they did against the Force last time out with a weaker 12 and 13 inside/outside them.

 

[fatprop]

Most of our best play has come from Foley getting the ball to our back 3 as quickly as possible, yes Izzy isn't there but I still think that backline is going to cause the Reds a lot of problems of set piece and turn over ball. Lets not forget some of the awesome attacking work they did against the Force last time out with a weaker 12 and 13 inside/outside them.

We have a 12 with the propensity to kick too often (although he have have got into the program by now) and a guy who hasn't done great in attack @ 13 for a while but has been great at 12.

I would have preferred

9 - McKibbin
10 - Foley
11 - Crawford
12 - Horne
13 - Kingston/Carter
14 - Betham
15 - Barnes

 

[cyclopath]

We have a 12 with the propensity to kick too often (although he have have got into the program by now) and a guy who hasn't done great in attack @ 13 for a while but has been great at 12.

I would have preferred

9 - McKibbin
10 - Foley
11 - Crawford
12 - Horne
13 - Kingston/Carter
14 - Betham
15 - Barnes

Maybe Cheika had a gentle word with Berrick, you know, like "Kick it like shit, remember, I know where you live".

 

[boyo]

partially why I think the real problems are so complex. I don't think its lack of trying either - I think it is twofold;

1. Trying - but with a limited vision of what you CAN achieve - (put simply, whether you really think you can win or not). example - English tennis players until last week / English Cricket teams for around 21 years - not now).

Andy Murray isn't English.

 

[boyo]

They're all full of promise, very few actually deliver (at least thats what I've heard).

Yeah, I'll believe you, thousands won't.

 

[Braveheart81]

Waratahs reserves are Luke Holmes, Jeremy Tilse, Will Skelton, Pat McCutcheon, Mitchell Chapman, Matt Lucas, Tom Carter, Ben Volavola with one to be omitted.

 

[Hell West & Crooked]

Andy Murray isn't English.

Well ok he's British... does not seem to be getting in the way of English Tennis Fans these past several days...

Actually, reading back - I don't think I said he was!

 

[JSRF10]

We have a 12 with the propensity to kick too often (although he have have got into the program by now) and a guy who hasn't done great in attack @ 13 for a while but has been great at 12.

I would have preferred

9 - McKibbin
10 - Foley
11 - Crawford
12 - Horne
13 - Kingston/Carter
14 - Betham
15 - Barnes

To be honest given how bad Barnes' kicking has been I'd prefer that he isn't at full back kicking away turn over ball. His best performances this year have been at 12, albeit mostly off the bench, so to be honest I'm happy enough to have him there.

 

[qwerty51]

Is Fitzpatrick no longer allowed to play for the Tahs (I think he was delisted for Chapman?). I imagine the rule is you have to play an uninjured squad member (Holmes) before you play someone outside the squad.

I would've had McCutcheon over Holloway. This selection makes no sense to me seeing as we're playing the Reds whose backrow is lightweight, mobile and hard on the ball. Holloway has shown promise but not enough to suggest he's a Super Rugby starter just yet. McCutcheon and Hooper would've been a good combo to counter Quirk, Gill and Schatz. Maybe it's a full contract trial for Holloway.

Happy with the backline with what's available.

 

[#1 Tah]

Waratahs reserves are Luke Holmes, Jeremy Tilse, Will Skelton, Pat McCutcheon, Mitchell Chapman, Matt Lucas, Tom Carter, Ben Volavola with one to be omitted.

As long as it isn't TC I'll be fairly happy with that side. They aren't world beaters but everyone selected is a Waratah through and through. Ill back them to get up.

 

[ShtinaTina]

Going from the Lions to the Reds/Tahs is like spending three weeks with Jennifer Hawkins, then having to go back to the good looking bird at work. Normally you'd be pretty happy with yourself, but after spending all that time with Hawkins it just doesn't excite you like you know it should...
.

Yeah it's like spending all that time with Izzy & then going back to you guys