RWC 2015 Semi Final 2 - Australia v Argentina Twickenham, Monday 19 October, 2:45 AEDT

[Jellic87]

So i think it must be asked; can we win the RWC without Pocock in the side!?

When Chieka got asked the question, he dodged it massively! He was hugely missed around the breakdown in the game against the Scots

 

[chasmac]

If you are calling for Cooper:

1. Watch Foley slot the arse-saving goal in the rain this weekend from 40 out. At least 20 times. Remind yoursekf that at that point he had to come enormous self doubt because if anyone knew he had an off day, IT WAS HIM.
2. Stand in front of a wall. Repeatedly bash your head whilst chanting "BMT, BMT, BMT"
3. Go back through ALL of the archives in the last 5 years. Produce compelling evidence of Cooper delivering in clutch, squeaky-bum, tight test match situations. Try not to trip over the howlers as you go along.
4. Go back to said wall. Bang head again. This time chanting "Can't find it, can't find it, can''t find it."
5. If you are still conscious, take your kind to the park and practice some no-look passes and try to get it out of your system.

You have got to be fucking kidding me.

BMT ?

 

[Blue]

BMT ?

BIG MATCH TEMPERAMENT

Also knows as balls.

 

[Brumby Runner]

i think Cheika has a coach's interest in getting him up to 60 and maintaining him as an option in the future - and i think that is why he was on the bench - Australia don't have the depth of players to just lose players like Cooper.

but the way the Scotland game went, I don't think he could risk his unpredictability - and when the rain came, 'that was probably the end of that'. It will be interesting to see if he can make either Bench - (if we actually have 2 games left). I don't think he can.

Win or lose, there are two games left for the Wallabies.

 

[Brumby Runner]

Ref: Barnes
AR's: Poite & Clancy
TMO: Skeen

EDIT: it's Poite, not Peyper (obviously).

Glad to see the muppet Jackson isn't involved in any way.

 

[Braveheart81]

So i think it must be asked; can we win the RWC without Pocock in the side!?

When Chieka got asked the question, he dodged it massively! He was hugely missed around the breakdown in the game against the Scots

What did you expect Cheika to say?

On what planet would Cheika talk about the final when we've still got a semi final to win to get an opportunity of playing for the RWC?

There's also no way a coach is going to suggest that his team can't win without a certain player. That would be the dumbest thing ever.

Pocock is our best player. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out that he's an incredibly important member of the team and his inclusion makes a big difference to our lineup.

 

[Viking]

If you are calling for Cooper:

1. Watch Foley slot the arse-saving goal in the rain this weekend from 40 out. At least 20 times. Remind yoursekf that at that point he had to come enormous self doubt because if anyone knew he had an off day, IT WAS HIM.
2. Stand in front of a wall. Repeatedly bash your head whilst chanting "BMT, BMT, BMT"
3. Go back through ALL of the archives in the last 5 years. Produce compelling evidence of Cooper delivering in clutch, squeaky-bum, tight test match situations. Try not to trip over the howlers as you go along.
4. Go back to said wall. Bang head again. This time chanting "Can't find it, can't find it, can''t find it."
5. If you are still conscious, take your kind to the park and practice some no-look passes and try to get it out of your system.

You have got to be fucking kidding me.

Now I am no way supporting Cooper to be included, but far out that is a ridiculous post.

1. It was barely 30 metres out, a bit past the 22 metre line, slightly to the right. Every international kicker is expected to kick those 9 times out of 10. It was an easy kick. A shit load of pressure but logistically it was a simple kick.

Besides the England game Foley has been average. He is far from the world-class flyhalves we've had in the past. Just because he is the best choice at the moment doesn't mean he is some magical god who is miles ahead of Cooper.

Foley has a lot yet to prove if he wants to cement his place as the long-term 10, because at the moment I can easily see Cooper, Lilo, To'omua taking his spot next year.

 

[Scotty]

I don't think the question should be around Cooper, but rather why didn't Cheika use To'omua in a game that was clearly calling out for some straight running and taking it to the line.

Cheika has been a bit off with his subs over the last few weeks (IMO).

 

[Braveheart81]

Besides the England game Foley has been average. He is far from the world-class flyhalves we've had in the past. Just because he is the best choice at the moment doesn't mean he is some magical god who is miles ahead of Cooper.

Against Wales his goal kicking and defence were outstanding. He figured reasonably well amongst the lower votes on the GAGR MOTM thread which is a pretty good indication he went well. In a game dominated at both ends by defence, he did well.

Foley made plenty of mistakes against Scotland including a couple of shockers but we scored 5 tries from consistently being in good field position and being able to isolate defensive mismatches and exploit overlaps. Sure, Foley didn't throw the final pass in any of the tries but that will often be the case with the 10 when three of your tries are scored on the wing.

This is such a pointless debate now. It's been run and won for now. Foley is the option. Next year is a new season. No one has a mortgage over their jersey.

 

[Jellic87]

What did you expect Cheika to say?

On what planet would Cheika talk about the final when we've still got a semi final to win to get an opportunity of playing for the RWC?

There's also no way a coach is going to suggest that his team can't win without a certain player. That would be the dumbest thing ever.

Pocock is our best player. It doesn't take a rocket scientist to work out that he's an incredibly important member of the team and his inclusion makes a big difference to our lineup.

I have no expectations on what Cheika should or would say, i simply heard it in the press conference this morning and thought it was a valid question and a
good topic to raise among people who love the game and appreciate discussing topics such as this. Of course a coach would never give a straight forward answer to a question like this but i wanted to hear peoples opinions.

So thanks for your opinion!

 

[Braveheart81]

I don't think the question should be around Cooper, but rather why didn't Cheika use To'omua in a game that was clearly calling out for some straight running and taking it to the line.

Cheika has been a bit off with his subs over the last few weeks (IMO).

Giteau had a strong game. I can see why it was hard to take him off.

 

[Viking]

It was a sublime Yellow Card?




Scored 28 points against England
Scored 15 points against Wales
Scored 15 points against Wales




Quade kicked at 55% against Uruguay.





STOP. STOP RIGHT THERE.

So you've spent some time pointing out Foley's shortcomings but you basically admit Quade isn't in form.

Yet you wondering why he was on the bench and not used?

Give me strength.

This isn't about Foley versus Quade, or NSW v QLD. Its about two players with varying abilities and form as part of a squad in a big tournament.

it was a soft yellow, his general play was good, He had a hand in 4 of the 5 tries. Foley barely touched to ball in all 5 tries against Scotland.

Scored 28 points England - Nice - this was a surprise to everybody
Scored 15 points against Wales - So he kicked a couple goals and this is a big deal?
Scored the winning goal against Scotland - He also cost us 7 points with a charged down kick, missed plenty of kicks. I think he cost us more points then he scored.

The reality is Foley needs to step up his game or we simply won't be winning the World Cup, let alone winning against Argentina.

 

[jollyswagman]

If you are calling for Cooper:

1. Watch Foley slot the arse-saving goal in the rain this weekend from 40 out. At least 20 times. Remind yoursekf that at that point he had to come enormous self doubt because if anyone knew he had an off day, IT WAS HIM.
2. Stand in front of a wall. Repeatedly bash your head whilst chanting "BMT, BMT, BMT"
3. Go back through ALL of the archives in the last 5 years. Produce compelling evidence of Cooper delivering in clutch, squeaky-bum, tight test match situations. Try not to trip over the howlers as you go along.
4. Go back to said wall. Bang head again. This time chanting "Can't find it, can't find it, can''t find it."
5. If you are still conscious, take your kind to the park and practice some no-look passes and try to get it out of your system.

You have got to be fucking kidding me.

Seriously Blue?.....we get the fact that you think the OP's idea might be ridiculous but suggesting that he "take his kind to park" for F-sake? Accept the fact that some on the boards may have a different opinion about a particular player and show a little bloody respect. Insinuating someone is some sort of idiot for having a different take is uncalled for......IMO

 

[Braveheart81]

So it's a big deal when he kicks poorly (as it should be) but no big deal when he kicks well?

The charged down kick only cost us 5 points as Laidlaw missed the conversion.

He had no direct try assists but threw the second last pass in AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper)'s try and Mitchell's first try.

Of course Foley needs to step up and play better against Argentina. Most of the team does.

It's great when the analysis boils down to watering down everything he does right and hyping up everything he does wrong.

 

[jollyswagman]

.........It's great when the analysis boils down to watering down everything he does right and hyping up everything he does wrong.

Agree with all of you comments there BH, but this does apply to most of the posts concerning QC (Quade Cooper) also. It seems as though it is impossible to be critical of Foley or Cooper in any way without everyone taking there respective corners and going hard at it.

 

[Pfitzy]

it was a soft yellow,

There aren't any "grades" of yellow. This isn't wine or cheese. He did something stupid and left his team a man down for 10 minutes. He did it in Auckland too, and his opportunity to make amends didn't start well.

- So he kicked a couple goals and this is a big deal?

Try and understand the scoreboard pressure that Foley hitting all his kicks puts onto Wales. There is a reason we didn't score any tries there: they were infringing every time we got within 30 metres of the line. Foley made them pay for it.

The reality is Foley needs to step up his game or we simply won't be winning the World Cup, let alone winning against Argentina.

If our forward pack doesn't front up, you can 45 Coopers in the backline to lather yourself over, it won't make a difference.

You spent all of your previous post comparing Foley to Cooper, and now you've given up talking about Cooper because you've been found out running your QLD fanboi line.

Just get behind the team FFS.

Cooper can be on the bench for mine - he has an ability to unlock the RSA and ARG defences in particular, based on his history. But that's the problem, its history.

With Folau likely to return, there isn't going to be enough room on the bench IMHO, and that's a shame for Cooper but his form through the year doesn't warrant inclusion over guys like Beale, To'omua, Horne, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Mitchell.

 

[Viking]

Against Wales his goal kicking and defence were outstanding. He figured reasonably well amongst the lower votes on the GAGR MOTM thread which is a pretty good indication he went well. In a game dominated at both ends by defence, he did well.

Foley made plenty of mistakes against Scotland including a couple of shockers but we scored 5 tries from consistently being in good field position and being able to isolate defensive mismatches and exploit overlaps. Sure, Foley didn't throw the final pass in any of the tries but that will often be the case with the 10 when three of your tries are scored on the wing.

This is such a pointless debate now. It's been run and won for now. Foley is the option. Next year is a new season. No one has a mortgage over their jersey.

The point is he needs to step up next game or we won't win. Simple as that.

 

[Braveheart81]

Agree with all of you comments there BH, but this does apply to most of the posts concerning QC (Quade Cooper) also. It seems as though it is impossible to be critical of Foley or Cooper in any way without everyone taking there respective corners and going hard at it.

I really don't think it does to anywhere near the same extent.

Many thought that Cooper had a real chance to stake his claim for the starting 10 jersey if he played very well in the Uruguay game, regardless of which player they preferred. Most apart from the most one-eyed Cooper fans thought that Foley was the likely frontrunner so the onus was on Cooper to play himself in.

Cooper's two biggest issues in that match were goal kicking and the yellow card. There was a huge raft of comments mitigating the poor goal kicking suggesting Cooper could be picked and Giteau could kick for goal instead.

The yellow card was laughed off as a poor decision by the referee and not worthy of mention. Anyone who brought up the fact that Cooper had been yellow carded in three of the last four tests he played were told they clutching at straws.

I certainly think there are some posters that are against Cooper pretty much regardless but I think they are outliers. I think there are far more posters who support Cooper and want him selected who are still casting this as merely a difference of opinion rather than what is at this point a pretty objective decision that Foley is a better option.

 

[jollyswagman]

There aren't any "grades" of yellow. This isn't wine or cheese. He did something stupid and left his team a man down for 10 minutes. He did it in Auckland too, and his opportunity to make amends didn't start well.

Maitland's yellow card is a great example of another "soft yellow" compared to Genia's yellow against Wales. Genia's was a perfect example of cynical play and was a deserved yellow in anyone's book. I actually thing Genia made the right call as he saved a certain try and the team was able to hold Wales out. But I don't recall his yellow being cause for so much outrage after the fact.

 

[Viking]

There aren't any "grades" of yellow. This isn't wine or cheese. He did something stupid and left his team a man down for 10 minutes. He did it in Auckland too, and his opportunity to make amends didn't start well.




Try and understand the scoreboard pressure that Foley hitting all his kicks puts onto Wales. There is a reason we didn't score any tries there: they were infringing every time we got within 30 metres of the line. Foley made them pay for it.





If our forward pack doesn't front up, you can 45 Coopers in the backline to lather yourself over, it won't make a difference.

You spent all of your previous post comparing Foley to Cooper, and now you've given up talking about Cooper because you've been found out running your QLD fanboi line.

Just get behind the team FFS.

Cooper can be on the bench for mine - he has an ability to unlock the RSA and ARG defences in particular, based on his history. But that's the problem, its history.

With Folau likely to return, there isn't going to be enough room on the bench IMHO, and that's a shame for Cooper but his form through the year doesn't warrant inclusion over guys like Beale, To'omua, Horne, AAC (Adam Ashley-Cooper), Mitchell.

Seriously? I'm a Brumbies supporter and all of a sudden I'm a QLD fan boy because you can't handle someone criticising your precious Foley.

What ever happened to play to the ball not the man? Really pathetic attitude mate.

The last 4 games I have never once supported the inclusion of Cooper.

But be fucking real. Foley needs to step up, and step up big time if we have any chance of winning the RWC, or even against Argentina.

He did it ONCE, he needs to do it again but he currently is just as bad as Cooper.

Don't know why your so defensive for?